Salome Schillack (00:00):
Hello, and welcome to episode number 132 of the Shine Show. Today's episode is called SLO and Affiliate Success with Roberta West. Roberta is one of my favorite students. Roberta helps entrepreneurs launch digital products and make money while they sleep, with evergreen funnels tailored to their business. It has been my absolute privilege to watch Roberta go from working in her job full time, to quitting her job, and to becoming an incredibly successful online teacher, online course creator, online launcher. She is one of the smartest marketers I know. Roberta is just going to blast off in the next year, so watch the space and enjoy this conversation with Roberta. Giving up your time and freedom to make money is so 2009. Hi, I'm your host, Salome Schillack and I help online course creators launch, grow, and scale their businesses with Facebook and Instagram ads, so that they can make more money and have an even bigger impact in the world. If you're ready to be inspired to dream bigger, launch sooner, and grow your online business faster, then tune in because you are ready to shine, and this is the Shine Show. Roberta, thank you so much for joining us on the Shine Show today. You've been one of my favorite students for so long, and I'm a huge fan of your work. So thank you for coming and sharing it with everyone.

Roberta West (01:46):
I'm so excited to be here, and sharing feels like you've seen the journey. I'm excited to show your listeners what we've been doing on the background for the past year.

Salome Schillack (02:00):
Well, the thing that I love most about the work that you do is you really trust your instinct. You have a very strong instinct for what works with your audience, what works for you and also you are a master of marketing. Let's just say that. You understand marketing and launching very-

Roberta West (02:21):
An apprentice.

Salome Schillack (02:21):
An apprentice.

Roberta West (02:25):
A good learner.

Salome Schillack (02:26):
You are a good learner. But you're also a good action taker. You just take things and run with it and I love it. So thank you for sharing that. I want to start with, I have seen your journey over the past, let's say, maybe a year or 18 months. But tell me what got you into launching a digital course business in the first place.

Roberta West (02:51):
Yeah. No, I think it's been a few years that I've been playing part-time into this role, into this business. I really liked having the questions answered without having to repeat myself. I don't know. It's just a personal preference to just say something once. And so, digital courses, back when I had a service, really fit that role of coaching and teaching people what I knew without having to say the same thing a million times, which is just a personality thing for me. It's one of those things I really hate doing. I always learned and took so much out of other digital courses. So it was just a natural thing, being my own ICA, my ideal client. I'm like, "This is how they are going to learn as well." I moved through a number of different projects, and courses, and ideas. But that's what got me excited about digital courses in the first place, and how I decided, when I quit my business, my corporate job last year. I really decided to go 100% into digital business, not even service, because I truly believe that's my magic. That's how I can help people the most, and being happy and fulfilled in the process. Yes.

Salome Schillack (04:26):
Yeah. When did you quit your job?

Roberta West (04:29):
End of October. I'm just fresh, like one year anniversary.

Salome Schillack (04:37):
Wow. I didn't even realize that. And so, before that, you had your service-based business that you were moonlighting.

Roberta West (04:49):
Yeah. No, I had a few courses, a few programs that I was testing and seeing where it all started. I was looking for that flame, that spark to quit my job and go full time. That's how I joined your group. I said, "You know what, I need to pass those ideas a little bit faster." That's how I found ads and getting into evergreen, making this funnel works for me. The original, the starting funnels that I had, I think, was because I wanted to test my ideas a lot faster. Because I was home with a preschooler full time, at home because of COVID, he was home full-time, I had a full-time job in corporate. So literally, I just didn't have the time to grow my list, or I had zero time to be on Instagram or to do anything like that. As you know, to test any idea, like even a tiny offer, anything, you need to have a hundred people. You need to get numbers. That was my first spark, like I should use ads, because at the time, I had a little money, obviously, working in corporate and I could test those ideas a lot faster. Just fell in love. When I found my spark, I quit my job.

Salome Schillack (06:32):
That's amazing. I love hearing that. I didn't know all these other little nuances of it. Wow. That's really cool. Tell us about your little spark, because your little spark is not such a little spark. It's a big spark. It's a very nice self-liquidating offer, or low dollar offer, or tiny offer that you just figured out from scratch, tested, tested, tested, and now it's not a little thing anymore.

Roberta West (07:01):
Yeah, no, it has been my graduation, I guess, into having a business per se. My program is one of those low ticket funnels that we see. It's very traditional, very typical. We have a small offer, another bump, and then a one-time offer, a little bit more. That's primarily how I grew the business from literally zero or spending money, like draining money last year, into almost like a quarter of a million this year, it was really the basic structure was this program. It's funny. I always hear people say like, "Oh, did you get lucky with it." I'm like, "There is no luck in business."

Salome Schillack (07:48):
There's no luck. There's no luck.

Roberta West (07:51):
There's a lot of hard work behind it. The spark, really, that I'm talking about last year was a different program. Was called Workshop Launch Kit and was like an all-in-one small program. It was priced a little bit around like 197 or 297. That's when I realized that I had something. I had a framework. I had something to give and I found my people, and I'm like, "Okay, this feels aligned. This feels easy and it has potential." So I started selling a little bit here and there with live webinars. I would feel a webinar, run the webinar, and then sell it, choose small cohorts of it. And then, as I was trying to scale that, then I found the idea, what people were really excited about, what lit them up every time I was showing the program. Wasn't the full program, but it was the launch plan. Having a template that people could just plug and play just literally people were so excited to just see that and have that plan done, something that they never really thought they could have done in like just seconds. That's when I decided to lean into it and create my SLO, really focused on that spark, that flame. People that really love that idea, I just went with it and built a funnel. Took me a few months, but I did it. Once you find what people really are excited to get, there is no stopping. That's the main difference, I think, between my funnel and others that might not resist the test of even the launch or the first few weeks. It's really finding that spark. It's almost like selling water in the desert on a hot, hot day.

Salome Schillack (10:05):
Yeah.

Roberta West (10:06):
People, they're like, "This is what I need." The price is a cherry on top, that is $37. You know what I mean? That more people can have it. But I think that's the premise, and that's how I found my sweet offer.

Salome Schillack (10:24):
Yeah. I love everything you're saying. I think, so often, like you say, it's like selling water to people in the desert who are really thirsty. You've always been talking to the same thirsty people. They've always been in the desert thirsty. You've always had the water, but there was a process that required a lot of hard work. It was internal work on your behalf and external work in terms of putting the offer in front of these people and doing it again, and doing it again, and going back to seeing what works, and back to seeing what works, and back to seeing what works until you figured out, "Oh, this is how I offer them water in a way that they want it."

Roberta West (11:13):
Absolutely. I think this trial and error and making offers in different ways is really what led me from October last year until March, in launching the actual funnel. It was a lot of work in there and just covering like, "What are the conversations already in their minds?" and how my idea, my expertise can really fit into that conversation. It really just came to just making more offers all the time. I commit myself last year to launching 12 times this year. I'm not going to make it. I'm just going to put it out there.

Salome Schillack (11:56):
No. No.

Roberta West (11:57):
I'm not going to make it. But I think it was really that turning point, from someone that would sit and overthink every single thing I would put it out there, trying to get it perfect, and end up selling sand in the desert, something the people just don't want and are seeing it enough, and really getting to the mindset of like, "I will get better at it." Every month that I launched something, could be like a free webinar, it could be a free challenge, no pitch, or it can be a new iteration of my launch kit, whatever it was, it didn't matter. But getting to this mindset of like, "I will figure it out. I know where I want to be with the kits." Being in the digital space is where I wanted to be. Now I just have to find that magical offer that helps a lot of people.

Salome Schillack (13:02):
Yeah. Oh, and I love that you found it. I want to ask you a question, because I know a lot of the listeners will be wondering about this, your dedication to testing and trying and keep iterating and keep changing and trying and trying again and trying again. Did you ever worry about money while you were doing this?

Roberta West (13:19):
All the time.

Salome Schillack (13:21):
Because it costs money to test things.

Roberta West (13:23):
All the time.

Salome Schillack (13:24):
Yeah.

Roberta West (13:24):
And the-

Salome Schillack (13:24):
How did you navigate that?

Roberta West (13:28):
First of all, last year, I had a corporate job. I don't take this lightly. It's really part of the conversation to have with yourself when you're in this process of trying and finding what works for you, how you're going to get funded. We don't talk about this in the online space enough. When you have a software or something that... Everybody understands the concept of funding your business, funding that prototype phase. But we don't talk about this enough. Obviously, I had my business, I had my corporate job, which provided all the basics. Plus a little money to test all of this. When I left, I had about 10,000 saved, That was like, "Six months, I'm just going to give myself time and energy to test it." But still, even if you have the money, and I know I've done it in the past, one of the best pieces of advice I got in this realm was to always invest at least 50% of whatever money you have into marketing. I really focused on that. I wasn't buying courses anymore. I knew what I knew and I was going to work with that. My only focus was to test it and put the money into this testing.

Salome Schillack (15:00):
Love it.

Roberta West (15:01):
You probably know this, but I'm really risk averse when it comes to money, like losing money. So I did a lot of micro testing, something that just like, "My budget is $200 for this go, as many people as it gets me, that's what I'm working with." And I think having that understanding that everybody has a budget and you have to stretch that budget as much as you can when you were in this phase that you don't know when you're going to hit that jackpot. You don't know how long it's going to take you. So definitely there is a conversation with yourself that I think we don't stress enough in this world, that is you are going to run out of money if you don't make a plan for it, and don't get that small results and build it from there. A lot of people just try to go to a million really fast. They have that million-dollar idea, like, "Oh, if I put a ton of money, I'm going to get to that." You know, I know you know that this is not how it works. Even with my funnel, when I launched, my entire wish and wildest dream for it was to have $2,000 a month coming in, in evergreen, so I could pay for my tech and a VA, and then working in other things. I could never imagine what happened, but that was the goal. That was the dream. I was too very realistic, even at that point, because you never know when you're going to... And you've got to give yourself enough time to get better at your messaging, get better at your graphics, get better at ads and all of the good stuff.

Salome Schillack (17:11):
The wonderful thing that I hear you saying is you took responsibility for your money. I can say, I did not take responsibility for my money when I started the business. And I was one of those people who just kept buying more courses and kept throwing more money at it, and more and more and more. Three years down the track, I was so stressed about money because I was $40,000 in debt. So funny that then, when I went back to my job, which I hated doing, but I had to, because I had to take responsibility for the money. When I went back to my job, and suddenly I know my family's taken care of, I know we're not living from the hand to the mouth anymore, I'm paying my $40,000 debt, and I have a little bit of money to invest in my business, because I removed that stress, suddenly things started working. I think that's what you were so good at, is you just don't put yourself in a position where it is going to be a place where you're not responsible or not able to take responsibility for it. That's amazing. And then, as you say, yeah, it's that you have the focus to say, "I'm not going to buy any more courses. I know what I know. I'm going to back myself and now I'm just going to go hard at testing." I love that so much.

Roberta West (18:36):
Yeah. This has been one of those things that, like you said, I've been through this for years. Having a job means that your business doesn't have to provide anything, not even the testing money, the launch money. Doesn't have to do it.

Salome Schillack (18:54):
The launch money. Yeah. Yeah.

Roberta West (18:56):
It's easy for us to just get in this mindset of, money just comes. Next month, you're just going to get more of it. But that was really evident when I had to transition out, is when I really felt that responsibility. I don't want to say that this came naturally to me. It didn't. I love getting the custom branding and all of that good stuff, but you have to be focused. I guess, the focus that you put in your business needs to attract and sell more so than to fix the backend, or to fix your own... I heard from, I think, Corinne Crabtree last year. She's like, "Your business is not your hobby. It's not supposed to entertain you. It's not supposed to give you life fulfillment. A business needs to make money, primarily." We have to make that decision. There's nothing wrong with playing in your business, trying to figure it out, and then having space to be creative and so on. But ultimately, if you're not investing a good amount, or reinvesting in ads or in social media or getting people into your world, how are you going to test your offers? How are you going to really get to the next level and sell and be a profitable machine? Definitely that's one of the focus I see people slipping, but I wish more people would focus on.

Salome Schillack (20:42):
Yes. I agree with you. Okay. We've mentioned your beautiful little spark, self-liquidating offer. But for those people listening, who don't know what an SLO, or a self-liquidating offer, or a one-time offer, or an upsell is, just talk us through your exact funnel from where you start running ads.

Roberta West (21:05):
Yep. My ads go to audiences that... You taught me how to target and how to find. When you see one of my ads... By the way, I just opened more ads, but I had the same two creatives and the same copy for over six months. So-

Salome Schillack (21:26):
And they worked.

Roberta West (21:27):
... you don't have much, you just need the right stuff, right?

Salome Schillack (21:31):
Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah.

Roberta West (21:33):
And so, it goes through cold audiences of people that never heard of me, never listened to anything that I put out there. They see this offer. They go to a sales page. It's a very lengthy sales page that they get all the details of what it is. Then there's an offer there for a $37 program, which is a combination of teaching and lessons about launch planning, and as well as templates, done-for-you templates in a variety of different programs that you can just download and create your own program, based on my own experience. So you get a lot of expertise just built in. Add that cart processor. Now you have an option to upgrade your order, with an order bump for $17, is my promo plan in a day. I really ran with the "in a day".

Salome Schillack (22:35):
Yeah. It's great. It's great.

Roberta West (22:36):
[crosstalk 00:22:36], you get up promo plan, templates for you to plan your promotion. And then, once you go through that process and you bought and select your purchase, then you go into one page that shows you a third offer, called one-time offer, in the industry. That is my Launch Firestarters, that you get your emails, like email templates and also other templates for your actual course or program. That's the whole funnel. You go through, you pick and choose whatever you want to need, and then you receive the program automatically through my automation.

Salome Schillack (23:25):
That is incredible. That's amazing. This is a profitable funnel. We just-

Roberta West (23:29):
That's a profitable funnel. It's been since day one and survived IOS.

Salome Schillack (23:37):
That is important. That is what makes the good-

Roberta West (23:41):
I know. It's a zombie funnel.

Salome Schillack (23:42):
Yeah. It's the zombie funnel. That is what makes this so impressive, because so many SLOs, or self-liquidating offer, or these low-dollar offers did not survive IOS. I want to ask you what you think the reason is yours survived IOS.

Roberta West (24:01):
Well, I'm not the expert. Maybe we should talk after that. I was really bracing myself. I was expecting the worst when I saw what was happening. It definitely slowed down, by the way. It definitely took a little bit of a hit there. But I think the reason why it survived is because my account had already a lot of good information. I think even when Facebook went blind for all new things, my account, it still had a lot of great information to go about. The other thing that I suspect is that I was, even when it wasn't really what we were seeing in the industry as standard, I was already tracking purchases, the actual purchase, with it. So I think it was a combination of luck that I was already at a stage that my account had enough information. If I would start tomorrow, if it would be the same, I'm not sure. But I've done other offers, and I feel like the account, once you have enough knowledge built in, that you can put anything for that same audience that Facebook just knows. Now they just know. Even with Google Ads and other things, there is something to be said that once you know how to target people, like how to find the right people for your offer, the people that really convert, that goes across any kind of promotion and marketing effort. So I think being niche enough, I knew exactly who I was talking to, what kind of problems they were experiencing. My sales page converts really well, meaning no matter if the traffic dries out a little bit, it still converts, right?

Salome Schillack (26:17):
Yeah. Yeah.

Roberta West (26:18):
I think it's this ecosystem of everything worked so well at a really high level that even when traffic slowed down a little bit, it would still be enough to keep the offer going.

Salome Schillack (26:33):
I love that. You are right. I want to say the reason you survived IOS is because you have a very good offer. You have good marketing. So you have a hungry crowd with a good offer. You have great copywriting. The copywriting on your page, it's fantastic. I also think it is the three paid offers. A lot of people run these low-dollar offers and they only sell one thing. You have the three things in place, and that really helps you recover a lot more money than what you're spending on the front end. And then, like you say, it is your account mojo. I'm always talking about building your account mojo. I think you should give yourself credit. It's not luck that your account had mojo on it. It was your hard work, and it was because you started when you knew social media's going to be the slow slog, and you knew you have to start building your account mojo. You just got started. Like you said, even when you had $200, you put your $200 in ads, and that's paying off for you really nice. Now you do have, your conversions has history on it. Your pixel has history on it. So even when IOS is just one plug that fell out of this ecosystem, your ecosystem held up. I think that's why it's worked so well and why it's continued to work so [crosstalk 00:28:10].

Roberta West (28:09):
Yeah. No, and I never stopped running ads, even if it was just engagement ads in between. When I was putting together this offer, I always thought it was important to keep it learning, right?

Salome Schillack (28:25):
Yeah.

Roberta West (28:25):
And always putting other offers to the same audience, meaning like free challenges, the bonus programs, like if I have affiliates. I continue to build that audience with similar offers or offers that I know that they are still hungry for. I keep it so super focused. Every money that goes in there helps build that funnel and other funnels like, well... I don't get distracted and I don't let Facebook get distracted as well.

Salome Schillack (29:02):
Yes. That's fantastic. Now, that was a great segment into your affiliates and your challenges. You have done, this year, that I'm aware of, you've done a very successful digital course academy launch. You also had a very successful business-by-design affiliate launch. I would love for you to tell us a little bit about your strategy with affiliates, because I feel like what you're doing is a little bit different from what everyone else is doing, and it's working really well. So tell us a bit about that.

Roberta West (29:35):
Yeah. Business By Design and digital course academy, honestly, I put so much effort ancient those affiliates because I had nothing else. The journey just restarts. You have an SLO that's working, so then you start back in the drawing board, like, "What else?" When I was in between trying to figure it out, what could I create next for my people? Those affiliates came in. So I said, "This is a great opportunity for me to test my ideas again." I could put ads, but I could also use this as an opportunity to really test my next level offer, my next offer, in an environment that the worst that can happen is I invest a little bit and I don't get everything back. Right. So I always came with those affiliates with a different mindset that's like, I'm not necessarily making money, or as an income generating activity. But it's a testing environment like, "Would people..." Obviously, they're all very aligned with my own offers. Selecting the right affiliate is very important. But I came in to test my next offer. That was my biggest spark. I think you're more interested to know what I did with DCA, which was different from Business By Design. But with that in mind, I really wanted, obviously, to support Amy and her program, which I vouch for. It's been one of the most foundational programs in my own journey. But I also wanted to see how I could add my own thing, my own ideas, my own program to support her launch. Like, would people be interested in a true two for one, right?

Salome Schillack (31:52):
Yeah. Yeah.

Roberta West (31:53):
Because most people do come in to... With their bonuses. It's like, "Oh, I have this one thing," or, "I'm going to do a special, quick workshop." I went all in. I said, "I'm giving you a whole new program, and it's one of those things that is going to really complement like it's my own journey. It's going to complement after you go through DCA. You're going to need an evergreen funnel in your business. So I'm going to give you a true two to one. I came in with that idea, that I was adding to her launch and not so much just piggybacking into or putting the launch in front of my people, which most of my people already know of Amy, right?

Salome Schillack (32:42):
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

Roberta West (32:43):
Or would already know. So I decided, and I heard a few other people in the past doing a similar strategy, and I wanted to try to run my own challenge. I put my own ads, I run my own challenge in support of digital course academy, or in support of the affiliate, which I thought was a game changer for me, because I got to really interact with people. Versus when you just send leads to someone else, you just don't get that interaction. You don't know how they are really experiencing the launch. So I wanted to test... With that in mind, I wanted to see how people are experiencing her launch, my launch, so I could get more information about the program that I was build or testing, as well as sending people to Amy and supporting her launch.

Salome Schillack (33:49):
Amy had that 30-day bootcamp-

Roberta West (33:52):
Correct.

Salome Schillack (33:52):
... leading up to her launch. Did you do your challenge during that bootcamp?

Roberta West (33:59):
The timing was really important. I mean, she had two months of promotion, like a pre-launch.

Salome Schillack (34:06):
Yeah, because I was going to say, if they were paying attention to what Amy was doing, Amy does a lot.

Roberta West (34:11):
Yeah. Yeah. I started early on, like the very first day, I think like two months before the actual launch. I started sending direct leads to her, but my leads were so high. The costs were so high, probably a combination of like IOS and everybody-

Salome Schillack (34:34):
Could you tell us how high? Do you want to say a number? Because I want to guess-

Roberta West (34:38):
Oh, I know. I know. I'm just a cheap lead kind of person. Anything around 10, I already started to, like, jittery and get jittery [crosstalk 00:34:48]-

Salome Schillack (34:47):
Yeah. Because I was going to say it was anywhere between 15 and 40 dollars.

Roberta West (34:57):
Yeah. No, mine was around 10 to 12 per lead magnets, like straight into her lead magnet.

Salome Schillack (35:04):
Yeah, and that's good. That's good.

Roberta West (35:06):
It's really good, but I knew that I could do better. I really knew that if I was putting my name and my expertise in it for... I launched like eight times year now, 10 times easier. So I know a little bit about my own audience and copy, because when you are sending someone to an affiliate, you have no control over their message, what they're doing. You just don't. You try your best with traffic, but that's not... My list is still tiny, to this day. It's just not something I've put effort into growing, meaning that I couldn't just send an email and then send her 300 people. It just wasn't my game. So you really need to assess, what are your strengths? I think that's one of the reasons why I wanted to share this, is most people don't have a huge list that they can do those affiliate promotions and just send a ton of people. So ads were really a big part of my strategy. But when I realized really early on that they were going to be more expensive, I decided to not send straight, to save my budget, and just run my own challenge in support. Her boot camp was a full month before cart open, which opened I think on a Tuesday. My challenge was the week before.

Salome Schillack (36:46):
I love it. The week before cart open.

Roberta West (36:49):
The week before cart open. Timing was one of the biggest things for this. It was the week before. And then, we were only allowed to promote our bonuses on Sunday. I did a live in the group. The group stayed open until her cart closed. I was really upfront with people, from the get-go, "This is in support of my mentor," [inaudible 00:37:19] feel like, she's opening digital course academy, and I'm doing this to get you guys ready. Let's plan your launch before you go. This is my whole theme. I just lean into it. It was the week before, and I didn't promote the bootcamp because, again, tiny audience, you really can't.

Salome Schillack (37:41):
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I hear you.

Roberta West (37:42):
People like a lot of things. I just focus on my own challenge, getting people results, like getting people excited about her launch, but through this challenge, which I called an internal launch. There was an external launch going on, Amy's, and I didn't even promote the webinar itself, other than just to that group. For that group, like people that were already in my launch. My launch list, my bonus launch list, those people got invited and I'm like, "Look, no pressure. If you don't need it, just go and watch it. She's the reference. Go there and watch it." That group stayed open and I did a few lives. I did a mini webinar myself on Monday before she opened cart, because I was really hoping to promote my course. I snuck in a little webinar for my program before her launch and it stayed open until her cart closed. And I had a little giveaway at the very last day.

Salome Schillack (39:04):
I love it. I love it.

Roberta West (39:05):
And that was it. So I ran ads. The bulk of my money really went into ads for that challenge or my bonus page. I did a launch, an internal launch while she was launching.

Salome Schillack (39:24):
It worked so well, and it makes such good sense. It makes such good sense.

Roberta West (39:30):
I think it really makes sense if you don't have a list. I mean, if you already have a big list that you can do exactly what I was doing at the challenge, which is nurturing and telling my story and how I use DCA to grow, then it makes sense to email your list and work with your list and do it that way. But for me, it's like I've got to get that launch list. I don't have...

Salome Schillack (40:01):
You say you don't have a big list, and that may be true. But remember, majority of the people on your list have already spent money with you.

Roberta West (40:09):
Absolutely.

Salome Schillack (40:10):
Because they've coming from your self-liquidating offer. So whilst you don't have a big list, you have a much better quality list [crosstalk 00:40:18]-

Roberta West (40:17):
Oh, 100%.

Salome Schillack (40:19):
Yeah. Yeah.

Roberta West (40:20):
100%. I think it's a [inaudible 00:40:25] list.

Salome Schillack (40:26):
A top-rated list.

Roberta West (40:27):
It's a top-rated list, a five-star list.

Salome Schillack (40:29):
Yes. Yeah.

Roberta West (40:32):
But also, when you think about it, and you have to understand, I think this is the secret of good marketing. You need to understand who those people are. A lot of people, a lot of people in my list, that bought Launch Plan In A Day, already either have Amy's digital course academy. This is their journey. They probably already tried and they're now at the stage that they're thinking about planning or getting better launches. I knew that if I had to quantify, a really big percentage of my list already know about Amy, already knew about James and Business By Design, and I wasn't really saying anything new. I was just adding like, "Okay, if you are on my list and you're still looking to buy, then I have this bonus that is absolutely fantastic. I always thought that my job with my list wasn't to educate them in who Amy is. But to put the offer in, I did. I did send sales email, like, "My cart is open. Here's my bonus package to my entire list," because that I thought was the game. I understood they already knew. I didn't have to nurture them, versus like if you're into fitness, or moms, or... For people that are not in the industry, maybe you have more success even with a small list, that educating them and getting them early in the launch. For me, I never thought that this is what they needed. Nobody needed to know about Amy and a course, they came to me already past that.

Salome Schillack (42:23):
Yeah. Yeah. When we think about our own customer journeys, like you talk about the fitness mom or all the other people that are affiliates, like the mindset coach, or the fitness, or the health, or whatever, they start the conversation based off of some lifestyle thing. That lifestyle thing, based on the work that their students do with them, then has the ability to turn into a business thing, which is where Amy starts to make sense to people and they need to introduce her and go through that journey. But you and I have that in common, in that, in that journey, we enter the conversation, usually, when people have already had the business conversation, maybe for two or three years sometimes. That's where your and my business becomes relevant to them. So I love how you've turned this, how you've been able to identify that and turn it on its head, and really used your message to go out there and get new people into your community. Because they've been in business for two, three years, they will know about Amy. I love that you say it kind of became a two for one deal. That's incredible.

Roberta West (43:52):
Yeah. I knew that was what my people wanted. They know what's going on. They don't need to be like that, "Oh, let me introduce you to-

Salome Schillack (44:06):
This.

Roberta West (44:06):
Right?

Salome Schillack (44:08):
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Roberta West (44:09):
When I talk to my people, I am very direct in the sense that I know you know. I'm not here to say the same thing again. Let me give you the next step. I think that's where you start really changing their perception and becoming more of that expert. And they trust what you say because you're being so open and say, "Look, if you already have a PLF or you already have Business By Design, you might not need this. Go for something else." Being honest and understanding what they already know I think is so valuable. It's so valuable. But now we're getting general marketing things.

Salome Schillack (44:57):
That is true.

Roberta West (44:59):
I don't think it necessarily is an affiliate conversation. But I think it's good to know, if you are doing an affiliate, where and when you're entering that conversation because-

Salome Schillack (45:14):
Absolutely. Absolutely.

Roberta West (45:17):
Because you're vouching for someone's course, but it's really about understanding, is this the right choice for my people? Even if you have a hundred people on your list or whatnot, the results you're going to get are really about the benefits that you communicate, right?

Salome Schillack (45:37):
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's what you're so good at. There's two things that stand out for me that you are so incredibly good at. It is hearing, hearing the conversation that is already going on in your customer's head, and then understanding how to communicate those benefits. You are absolutely incredibly good at both of those things. And I just want to say congratulations on all the success you've had in the last... I've been part of your journey from I think... When was it? We're just over maybe 16, 18 months now, something like that?

Roberta West (46:11):
Maybe, yeah.

Salome Schillack (46:12):
Yeah. But congratulations. It has been an absolute joy to see you grow and to see you take action. You're one of the smartest women I know.

Roberta West (46:22):
Oh, I'm blushing because I think you taught me a good deal of it all.

Salome Schillack (46:29):
Well, I hope so. I hope so. But you teach me along the way and you just have such a beautiful way of just cutting through the BS and seeing it for what it is. It's just incredible seeing you grow. I can't wait to see where you're going to be next here this time. [crosstalk 00:46:46].

Roberta West (46:46):
I'm excited for the journey too, and to share a little bit more of a different strategy or a take. Definitely, even if you have a small list... This has been my journey that you helped me develop as well, is even if you don't have that many people, you can still make a difference. You can still test and get people in and make big results, that could get the return that you want. You just need to pay attention to what they need. Sometimes we don't.

Salome Schillack (47:26):
Sometimes we just have to, like you say, you just have to test it, and test it, and test it, and test it.

Roberta West (47:30):
Testing.

Salome Schillack (47:30):
Until you do, until you do. Yeah. Roberta, if anybody wants to learn more about you, where can they go?

Roberta West (47:39):
robertawest.com is the hub for all things. Yeah, I can't wait to hear if anybody, any of your listeners, are putting in practice or are implementing this internal launch kind of strategy. I would love to hear more. They can find you and get the guidance they need for all ads and all marketing things in your community as well.

Salome Schillack (48:09):
Oh, that's awesome. Yeah. This episode will be promoted on Instagram. So if you guys, whatever you learn from Roberta on this episode, come and share it with us on Instagram. We're going to tag Roberta and she will see it there too. You can go check out her Instagram and make sure you let her know what you've learned from today's session. Thank you so much, Roberta. I appreciate you.

Roberta West (48:33):
Thank you, Salome.

Salome Schillack (48:35):
Well, there you have it. Roberta is such a smart marketer. Do yourself a favor, make sure you come say hello to her on my Instagram, where we're going to post everything about this episode. Check her out at robertawest.com. Have a lovely, lovely week and I will talk to you again next week and remember to hit that subscribe button so you never miss a thing.