podcast episodes

Today I'm getting a thorn out of my side…pesky little Low Dollar Offers.

When your main offer isn't flying out the door, it's completely normal to think…

"What if I sell all that value for just $27? It’ll be the deal of the century! I'll hit 1000 sales in no time and CHA CHING baby, I'm a 5-figure launcher”…..

Super easy, right?

Hoolllldddd up!

Low Dollar Offers can actually do the exact opposite of a 5-figure launch and land you a 5-figure loss, sending all your precious moolah straight to Zuckerberg's pocket.

Here's a truth bomb for you:

Loyal, high-paying, sustainable students won't need a huge discount to want to work with you!

They will be happy to pay what you're worth.

$27…$1,000...even $10,000…because your superpowers are helping them to solve a huge problem. Imagine if a dream student who would be happy to pay $1,000 for your course, jumps on board for just $27?

Sure, they scored a bargain, love that for them; but YOU end up missing out, big time. And after all the hard work you’ve poured into your business, you deserve to receive what you're worth.

So why are there so many Low Dollar Offers flying around? When do they actually work?

This week on The Shine Show, I'm exploring the in's and out's of Low Dollar Offers, how they work and how you can decipher if it's the right option for your next launch.

Don't even think about slashing your prices until you've listened to this episode.

XXX

Salome

PS: Doors to The Launch Lounge are officially open; this is your chance to join the hottest community of online course creators. Get personalized coaching from ad strategists, launch specialists, marketing strategists, and copywriters. Inside you'll get the support, the community, and the education you deserve. No one size fits all solutions, just the right information when you need it. If you're ready to scale your business to 7 figures and beyond, join The Launch Lounge now before doors close. Click HERE to learn more.

Subscribe and Review in iTunes Please!

When you subscribe and review the podcast not only does that give me the warm and fuzzies all over, it also helps other people to find the show.

When other people find the show they get to learn how to create more freedom in their lives from their online courses too!!

So do a good deed for all womenkind and subscribe and review this show and I will reward you with a shout out on the show!!

Join us today in The Launch Lounge Membership

Links I mentioned in this episode:

Scroll down for a full transcript of this episode

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TRANSCRIPT

Hello, and welcome to episode number 165 of The Shine Show. Today, I'm getting a thorn out of my side. That thorn is these pesky little low-dollar offers that everyone thinks they're just going to throw it out there and it's going to be super easy. So today's episode is called, The Only Way Low-Dollar Offers Are Working Today, and you are going to walk away from this episode, having complete clarity about when and how to use these low-dollar offers that you see flying around everywhere. Enjoy the show.

Giving up your time and freedom to make money is so 2009. Hi, I'm your host Salome Schillack and I help online course creators launch, grow, and scale their businesses with Facebook and Instagram ads, so that they can make more money and have an even bigger impact in the world. If you are ready to be inspired, to dream bigger, launch sooner, and grow your online business faster, then tune in because you are ready to shine, and this is The Shine Show.

Hello, my friend, it's good to be hanging out with you today. I got asked the other day by Kirby on my team, she said, "So Salome, you told us about a year ago, six months ago that you are going to do the 100 100s at swimming. Where are we at with that?" She said, and well my friends, I am happy to announce to everyone, and the reason I'm telling you this is because I need accountability.

It's a funny thing, I never need accountability in my business. I'm really good with staying accountable to myself when it's business stuff, but sporty stuff, health stuff, not eating the chocolate, all the chocolate, getting my butt in the pool. Man, I need accountability, because I like working and I like watching TV, but when you hit 42, you can no longer just work and watch TV, your brain and your body freaks out when you do that. I have firsthand experience of that and I can hear a few of you giggling, who also have experience with that.

Man, this 40 thing is interesting. We are in the best years of our lives, my kids are growing up, they don't need me that much. I love the freedom and independence of kids who can do their own thing, and yeah, so I have officially enrolled in swimming, 100, 100 meters. It is going down on the 9th of September, 6:00 that evening I will be getting into the pool. The pool is 25 meters long and I will be swimming 400 laps in four hours. I have four hours to swim, 400 laps.

Breathe. The interesting thing that I will share a bit more with you all, one day here on the podcast is watching my brain freak out after making this commitment. There was the initial, well now I'm going to have to go swimming every single day and hustle my face off, anxiety, which I luckily was able to talk myself out of and I went, "No, hang on, there is no need to go into complete overdrive over this because... So you get in the pool and you don't finish it. Who cares? Doesn't matter. You got in the pool, you did some of it." But somewhere in the perfectionist brain that, or just at least the normal brain that wants things to be perfect, and wants me to really impress people, it went into overdrive.

My brain went into overdrive and said, "Well, now you're going to have to practice a lot more and work a lot harder, and go swimming every single day and hustle your face off." And then I was like, "Oh no, no, no, no, that will not be happening." And then my brain went to, "Well, what if you don't finish? What if you make fool of yourself? What if you get in the pool and you only finish 50 of the 100?"

And it was interesting, I was like, "Okay brain, nice job. Nice offering me up the trying to keep me safe. So what? If I only finished 50? So what? If I only finished 25? Who is the success police that tells us that we can only sign up for things if we're going to excel at them?" So I am consciously doing this so that I can retrain my brain to be more comfortable with failure.

So maybe I'm going to fail. I call it fail but I want to say maybe, just watching my brain freak out and being aware of how it is just doing what brains do and it has absolutely nothing to do with me getting in a swimming pool on the 9th of September and moving my arms and my legs until I'm done. And if everyone else does a 100 100s and I do 50 100s then the victory will be what I learned about my brain and how I created a safe space for myself to create distance between me and the nonsense that my brain dishes up for me, because the more I can learn that I am not my brain.

I am not my limiting beliefs. I am not the perfectionist beliefs that pop up. I am not the fear of failure. I am not the fear of embarrassment, or the fear of shame. It is not me. It is not my identity. It is just my brain chattering the way that brains do and if I can learn to look at it almost as a third person, pay attention to it, acknowledge it, and then not be so associated with it then that will help me in other areas of my life. It'll help me in the business, it will help me in my personal life, it'll help me in my marriage, it'll help me be a better mother, it'll help me in so many areas.

The more opportunity I have to learn how I am not my brain, I share this with you, bravely, confidently, and I'm excited to report to you how often my brain freaks out and how I am going on this journey. So stay tuned if you want to hear more about Salome's brain freaking out, over swimming. And then on the 9th of September, you better send me all your hugs and love and motivation and cheering and send me all the Powerade and bananas and pasta the night before, I'm going to have to carbo-load and watch me cry on Saturday the 10th, I'm probably going to sleep the whole day.

So that's what I'm up to my friends, but today I want to talk to you about something else. Today, I want to talk to you about the only way that low-dollar offers are working today and the reason I have created this episode, is because if I had a dollar for every time one of my students said, "This isn't working, I'm just going to try one of those low-dollar offers." I'd be rich, might be so rich and I want to say, I get it, they look so simple, they are so deceptively simple. Those $27 offers, those little tiny offers, those mini offers, those self-liquidating offers, is the fancy word that marketers use, and then they abbreviated to SLOs or SLO's.

But I want to say to you that those tiny offers, those $27 offers that you see, if you see it being advertised directly to you as a low-dollar offer, just know that there's a lot that goes into that, and it's an advanced ad strategy. Now I'm going to tell you how to do that because I want you to be empowered to do it, should you choose to do it.

But I'm also going to give you an alternative that is a lot easier, that is a lot cheaper, and that allows you to have a safe space where you can practice making offers without making tremendous donations to Mark Zuckerberg's pocket, that does not actually result in money in your pocket. So my hope is that at the end of this episode, you walk away and you have some idea of when it's the right time to use those tiny offers or self-liquidating offers, and when it's the absolute wrong time, and then you also know how to do it correctly.

So if you are one of my students, if you are either in A-lister or in The Launch Lounge, you would know that what I teach is we always, always start by building our email lists. And maybe somewhere in my programs, you've come across my little model that I'm working on, that I have shared with some of the students, I haven't shared with everyone but I've shared it on the podcast many times. I've just never called it a model but let me explain my little, my model of marvel.

My model of marvel for building online courses is basically this. There are only three things that you can control in your online courses business. You can control audiences, you can control your offer, and you can control your launch mechanism. Audiences are either social media audiences, or podcast listeners or YouTube watchers, or they might be people on your email list, or people visiting your website or people finding you from ads. Those are all audiences and you have a degree of control over that.

Then your offer, you can control your offer and the better you learn to listen to the needs of your ideal customer, the better you get at making offers. Most of us, me included, even if I have a marketing degree and I still had to learn from scratch, had to listen to my ideal customer, how to learn how to make an offer to my ideal customer? Because we just don't learn that stuff.

Even if like me, you have a marketing degree, well you were probably taught marketing the old fashioned way. I don't know those of you who are as old as me, you would remember the five P's of marketing, product, price, positioning, packaging, and something else, I don't remember what. That's the kind of stuff we learned at uni back in the 2000s. None of this online marketing stuff existed and certainly none of this direct-to-customer marketing existed, it was all TV ads.

Back in the day when I worked in an ad agency, the only digital stuff we did was websites. Most of the rest of the stuff were ads for magazines and radio ads and if you ask me about all of that stuff, I would've said, it's really exciting but if you told me 20 years later, will be advertising on mobile phones that we carry around, well, we did have mobile phones then, but if you told me, we'd be advertising on our mobile phones where we're scrolling on social media, I would've said you're crazy.

So this stuff is new and most of us have to learn this stuff from scratch and most of us are not good at making offers when we start out. So throwing Facebook ad money at offers that we haven't yet gotten good at making, is a sure way to waste a ton of money, but we can control what offers we make. We can control how often we make those offers and we can control how much we take the feedback from our audience into consideration once we've made the offers, so that we have the knowledge we need in order to tweak those offers. Right? So in that way, you can control your offer.

The last thing, and the third thing that you can control is your launch mechanism. You get to choose whether you use a webinar, a video series, challenge, workshop, an email sequence, there is a bit of a menu and you get to choose which one you use. And from my point of view, there are certain ones that work well for certain price points, and others that work better for those price points.

But the basic premise of, the basic foundation of what you should use as a deciding factor for which launch mechanism you use is what is your price point? The price point of your offer, because the higher the price point is, the larger you're going to need your audience to be and the more time you're going to need to spend with that audience. So if I'm selling a $30,000 one-on-one coaching consulting package, I'm not going to run an ad to cold traffic for a $30,000 thing.

No, I'm going to make that $30,000 thing my highest level offer that is only available to people who have already taken my courses, who already know, like and trust me so much. They already know, like and trust me, $30,000 much. Right? So I'm not going to lead with that.

Now I know that logic then makes people go, "Well, let me just run ads for $27 offers, because I can run ads and put a $27 offer right in front of people and then they'll buy." But here's the thing, here's why it's not working. It doesn't work because the algorithm, because A, most people who start, who wants to use that as a strategy, wants to use that because they think that's an easier offer to make.

If their other offers have not resulted in profit, they think it's easier to sell a $27 thing than it is to sell a $2,000 thing. And I want to tell you, it's harder to sell a $27 thing, than a $2,000 thing. Yeah, there I said it, it's harder to sell a $27 thing, than a $2,000 thing.

The reason I say that is when you're selling a $27 thing and you're selling it to people who have never in their lives heard of you, that offer needs to be so strong and compelling. You need to meet that ideal customer, you're putting the ad in front of, exactly where they are at in the right moment in time with a very specific clearly defined offer, so that's your first challenge.

So if you've ever thought that a $27 offer, to run ads to a $27 offer, is going to get you further than learning how to launch your online course or learning how to make offers to your email list, to get them into your lower dollar membership or course I want to say, it's not going to work that way.

The second thing that I want you to know about these $27 offers is if you think about the algorithm, and you think about how the algorithm works. So the algorithm is basically, think of it as a little spider that has to run through a network.

So picture, place sites, 60 million people with Facebook on their phones and they're all looking at Facebook at the same time and you've just put an ad, published an ad in Facebook and now the algorithm has to find the right people to put this ad in front of, and so that little spider starts to run and it runs through everybody's phones.

And whenever somebody clicks on your ad, the algorithm learns because the algorithm can see everything about that person and it goes, "Oh, okay. So here is a 27 year old male, who is interested in GQ magazine and also in protein powder and also in Netflix and also in beer. This is the person who clicked." Now, the algorithm learns that, and it skews where that little spider runs, to try to find more 27 year old males who are interested in beer and gym.

And now someone else clicks, and it looks at that person and it learns, and it puts the information together from person number one, from beer dude, to person number two. Now let's call person number two, a 27 year old female, who is into CrossFit. Okay. So we've got beer dude and CrossFit chick, and now the algorithm, it keeps running and it goes, "Oh." And it starts building up a profile of a typical person who's likely to click on the ad, and that little spider keeps running and keeps running and then it gets lucky and it gets into the newsfeed of someone who converts to a sale.

Now the algorithm knows what someone looks like who converts to a sale. Now let's say, this someone is a 32 year old, let's say it's a woman who is interested in professional basketball and she is interested in whole foods and she's interested in Netflix, and she's interested in World Cup Rugby, let's go with that. Okay, so now it converted someone. Now it is learning again.

Now the value of what it learned from the person who converted to a sale, versus all of those people who just clicked on the ad, the value of what it learned from the person who converted is weighs more, and it weighs more because you've optimized for conversion, because that's what you've told Facebook you want. You've said, "I want a conversion." And a conversion means, a person who buys my $27 thing, that is a conversion.

And so whilst that little spider was running through everybody's phones, trying to find this right person to put the content in front of, it learnt and it learnt and it learnt and then it put together what it learnt so that it can aggregate that information, to the point where it got a conversion. Whilst it got that conversion, it was like the alarm bells went off and it went, "Pew, pew, pew, pew! We have a conversion! We have a conversion!" And then it knows what that conversion looks like, and now that little spider starts running again, and it starts finding more people who are likely to convert.

My whole long story about the little spider, the point of it is this, the algorithm works hard to optimize and there are conditions that can be favorable for the algorithm to optimize, and conditions that are not favorable for the algorithm to optimize. When you are running a lead magnet ad, which is a free offer, the algorithm does not work as hard as it does when you're running a $27 offer, because fewer people are likely to take you up on the $27 offer than they are on the free offer, and because fewer people take you up on that $27 offer, the algorithm has to work harder.

Now we know because Facebook tells us, that in order for the algorithm to fully optimize, it needs about five conversions per day, five to 10 conversions per day. So you would need five to 10 sales of a $27 product, before the algorithm has enough information from learning to give you more sales.

Now let's assume for a second that you are making, let's say you're making a dollar on every sale, so that means if you have a $27 thing that you're selling, it's going to cost you $26 to make a sale, and you need five conversion, so 26 times five is $130. So you are going to need to spend at least $130 per day, just to be able to give the algorithm the minimum it needs, to get you five conversions so that it can optimize.

Hands up, if you have $130 a day, to spend on an offer that you haven't yet tested and that you don't know that it's working. Hands up, if you have $130 a day to spend on ads, if you haven't yet had a profitable online course launch. Hands up, if you still think a $27 offer is a good idea. It may be, for some of you because for some of you $120, $130 a day is probably peanuts compared to what you're spending in your launches, and that's great.

But nine out of 10 times, those tiny offers don't make a profit on the front end. Nine out of 10 times, the tiny, the $27 offer costs you $50 for a conversion, so you pay $50 per conversion to get a $20, $27 sale. Now you might be asking, "Well Salome, what is the sense of doing that if it's costing me $50 to get a $27 sale?" And I'll tell you what the benefit of that is, the benefit is two things.

Number one, someone who has forked out $27 is worth a lot more in your funnel down the track, than a free loader. So it could be worth paying to get better quality leads, leads who have already paid you. The other benefit of it is, you're not going to stop a $27 offer.

Once they click on that ad, there's going to be an order bump, so maybe you're going to say, "Well, you can get the upgraded version for another $17." And then they're going to say, "Yes, please." And then they're going to say, "Go to checkout." And when they go to checkout, they're going to go to another page that's going to sell them the next thing, that's $47 and then they're going to say, "Oh yes, please, I want this." And then that's going to take them to the next page that sells something for $97 and that's going to take them to the next sales. And do you know what I have done? I have bought from Mr. Frank Kern himself, his entire library of courses for $3,000 once, just that's it started with a $4 sale. I followed a $4 sale all the way up to $3,000 to buy his entire library of courses.

Now I know that, that's not what everybody does, but Mr. Frank Kern knew that there are freaks like me out there, who wants to buy every online course they can possibly get their hands on, because they are obsessed with online course launching. Do not judge me. And I have been looking at some of Frank's courses before, thinking, "Well, they're $5,000 a pop. I'm going to have to spend like 30k to get everything." So in my view, $3,000 was nothing, to get Frank all of his courses, everything he's ever created and so I did that.

But even if, most of the people who take you up on that front end, the $27, just add the order bump, you're still building your list with much better quality leads even if it costs you a little bit of money. So there is method in the madness of these $27. However, they are expensive because let's consider, if you need to pay, let's say you need to pay $50 to get a $27 conversion and you need five conversions a day, now we're talking about spending $250 a day.

$250 a day for an entire month is $7,500 that you're spending on ads. Hands up if that's in your budget. Yeah, I guess not, because I know that in my audience, there's maybe a handful of you with $7,500 to spend on list building per month. I'm not even spending that much on list building every month. So, what I want you to take away from this, is that you can control your audience, but there are better ways to do it than through these $27 offers.

You can control your offer, and if your offer is not converting, the solution is not to try to find a shortcut. The solution is to lean in even more and figure out why it's not working, not running $27 offers. And the third thing is, a launch mechanism for $27 offers is an advanced launch mechanism. It's an advanced ad strategy.

It's something you do, when you know you can sell your stuff with your eyes closed. It's something you do, when you know that paying for leads who have already paid you for your slow dollar offer, turns into more students for that $3,000 course or $30,000 coaching program. That's when the $27 offers work really well. That's when the $27 offers turn into profit. That's when you make money with $27 offers.

I asked my wonderful team who helps me put together the content for the podcast to research this a little bit, and find some other small things that are not so great, and we found on BuzzFeed this article, and I'm going to read to you some of these because I want to leave you laughing and I want to leave you knowing that $27 offers on Facebook ads are not the only tiny things that are annoying and that don't work. So here are some funny things, that is not necessarily better when it's bigger.

Someone on Reddit said, "Passing a kidney stone." That's true. Someone else said, "Cockroaches, especially when you travel in the more tropical areas." "What about pimples? Pimples are not necessarily better if they're bigger." "Cell phones, nobody likes to say, look at my big cell phone!" "What about when the curtain in your bedroom has that tiny little gap, that little gap that's letting in the sunrise and they penetrate your eyeballs, that's when little things are not necessarily better." Or the last one where smaller is not necessarily better is, "Fitted sheets. I mean, hello?" Oh, fitted sheets drives me nuts, Emil and I have one of those extra thick mattresses and trying to get a fitted sheet on there. How many nails have I broken trying to get a fitted sheet onto that mattress?

Okay. My friends, well that is that for today. Now, you know that smaller is not necessarily better, and what the only way is you should be using these tiny little offers. But talking of things that are better, that are bigger and brighter and bolder and gets you further in your online course launch, you have been waiting for the doors to open for The Launch Lounge, and this week the doors are actually officially open.

So if you want to become a member of the hottest community online for online course creators and membership owners, who are learning that there's no one-size-fits-all way to grow your launches, to scale your business, to bigger profits and more freedom, then I want to invite you to come and join us inside The Launch Lounge. We have coaching calls from ad people, launch planning people, marketing strategists, experienced online courses copywriters, you name it. We have got the support in there. We have the community in there for you and we have the education.

This is not a one-size-fits-all paint by numbers online course, just the information you need, when you need it to grow and scale your online course business. And you can join today by going to shineandsucceed.com/launch. I would love to see you inside The Launch Lounge, the doors will close again on Friday, come and join me inside The Launch Lounge, I'll see you there.

If you love this episode and you are a committed online course launcher who wants to learn how to grow your profits in your next course launch, and you want to know how to successfully scale your online courses business to seven figures and beyond, then I'd love to see you inside The Launch Lounge.

The Launch Lounge is the only community online that is dedicated solely to helping you develop every aspect of your online courses business, so that you can build your business to scale with no one-size-fits-all solutions, just the right education you need when you need it. Coaching from our team of experts in different areas of launching and scaling and the best community on the internet, The Launch Lounge, is your online course building home, if you want profitable launches that scale your business to seven figures and beyond.

To get on the wait list for our next enrollment season, go to shineandsucceed.com/launch. Thank you so much for listening, if you had fun, please come back next week and remember to hit that subscribe button, so you never miss a thing.

164. New Ad Targeting Options That Are Working Now

164. New Ad Targeting Options That Are Working Now

12 July 2022 | By Salome Schillack

listen now:

Finding the right people when you advertise on social media means half the battle is won!

When you have great ad copy and a great message, you want the confidence to know for sure that your ad dollars are getting your message in front of the right people.

But how do you do that if the platform and the rules keep changing?

Easy, you listen to today’s episode of The Shine Show with ad experts Caroline Fenton and Amy Wyhoon as they share with you all the ad targeting that is working right now.

Tune in to today’s episode if you’re ready to be discovered by more of your future students.

XXX

Salome

P.S. If you loved this episode and you're a committed online course launcher who wants bigger profits in your next launch, then The Launch Lounge is the place to be. No one size fits all solutions, just the right education you need when you need it, 1:1 coaching from experts in different areas of launching and scaling, and the best community of online course creators on the internet. It’s the place to be if you want to reach 7 figures and beyond. Doors are opening soon. Join the waitlist here.

Subscribe and Review in iTunes Please!

When you subscribe and review the podcast not only does that give me the warm and fuzzies all over, it also helps other people to find the show.

When other people find the show they get to learn how to create more freedom in their lives from their online courses too!!

So do a good deed for all womenkind and subscribe and review this show and I will reward you with a shout out on the show!!

Links I mentioned in this episode:

Scroll down for a full transcript of this episode

more episodes

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166. How To Create Your Online Course Faster with Gina Onativia

165. The Only Way Low Dollar Offers Are Working Today

163. How To Transition Out Of 1-1 Work Without Losing Income

TRANSCRIPT

(00:00):
Hello, and welcome to episode number 164 of The Shine Show. Today, we're going to be talking about new ad targeting options that are working really well now.

(00:16):
Giving up your time and freedom to make money is so 2009. Hi, I'm your host Salome Schillack, and I help online course creators launch, grow, and scale their businesses with Facebook and Instagram ads, so that they can make more money and have an even bigger impact in the world. If you're ready to be inspired, to dream bigger, launch sooner, and grow your online business faster, then tune in because you are ready to shine, and this is The Shine Show.

(00:49):
Hello there, I hope today's episode finds you really, really well. Do you know what my favorite time of the week is? My favorite time of the week is... Actually, I have two favorite times of the week. The one favorite time of the week is a Tuesday morning, an Aussie Tuesday morning, which is a Monday afternoon in the US when we release a podcast episode because I know on a Tuesday and a Wednesday I get emails from you guys.

(01:21):
And, I love getting emails from you guys. I love it when we send out the podcast newsletter and you hit reply and you tell me what you thought about the episode or what you learned in the episode or how the episode is helping you. I have never, ever, ever had as big a response to a podcast episode as I had about the episode where I talked about what to do when you don't like your business anymore. Man, you guys and gals, there's a lot of us out there who has felt this way. There's a lot of you out there who's feeling this way right now. I have felt that way, and it's important that we say that to each other because social media is so fucking fake and it leaves everyone, especially if you are feeling a little despondent, feeling a little bit like you should be further than you are, it leaves you feeling like, man.

(02:41):
The feeling that I used to have is there's something wrong with me. That's how I used to feel. There's something wrong with me. Why is it taking me three years to figure this thing out? And if that's you right now, ugh, I want to give you the biggest podcast hug, the biggest, biggest podcast hug. And, I just want to let that just like someone who goes to college or university to learn to become a doctor, they don't know how to be a brain surgeon the moment they enroll in medical school. There's certain skills that just takes time, and building an online business really is not just as simple as grabbing your phone and starting to talk into it, and then suddenly you manifest a bunch of money, and a lot of the time I see people saying, "Well, the only reason you haven't made money is because you don't have the right money mindset," and it's such crap.

(03:43):
There is nothing wrong with you. There is nothing wrong with you. You're just still learning the skills. So hang in there, and if you've learned some skills and you've built a business that you don't like, I have news for you, you could start over, you can change it. You get to do that. You have a lot more freedom than you feel you have just because we weren't raised to believe we have freedom, and just because our funny little brains tell us we don't have that freedom, so lean into that. Wow, I was not planning on going off on that tangent, but I love tangents. Don't tangents feel good? They feel good because we got to get the stuff off our chests. Second favorite time of the week is geek meeting. Every Thursday afternoon at 1:00 PM, Brisbane time, the geeks get together in my business and we go deep geek on our CEO level clients' work.

(04:59):
And, lately we've been going deep geek on some of the VIP clients' funnels and businesses as well. If you don't know what CEO or VIP is, they are two different levels of the launch lounge. So, when you join the Launch Lounge you can join as a regular member or after six months you qualify to become a VIP, which means you get a lot more time with me, and when you've hit six figures and you're ready to scale to seven figures, you come and join us inside the agency where we are now, calling this CEO level where we help you build your business as marketing consultants. It's way more than just an ads agency. We don't just manage your traffic, we help you, we consult on how you can scale your funnels and reach more people. So, Thursday afternoon one o'clock, the geeks come together.

(06:01):
The geeks consist of me. I'm probably the least geeky person in the geeks meeting, but I'm there, and then my two OGs are there, Hannah and Caroline. Caroline was the original OG Facebook ads manager I hired to work with me way back in 2018, and she still geeks out with us on our clients' funnels and Hannah, who's just the smartest person I know when it comes to data analytics and recently we've added Amy Wyhoon, Facebook ads manager to the mix.

(06:45):
We've added Tonia Krebs to the mix. Tonia is our community manager inside the Launch Lounge, and occasionally we have Rebecca join us as well. Rebecca is my customer support manager for the CEO level clients. So, she treats the CEOs like CEOs and she makes them feel like CEOs because that's how Rebecca rolls. So, Thursday afternoon we geek out and we go deep, deep, deep on all things, building audiences, making offers, and building funnels, data and analytics, which platforms are working the best, where's the best traffic coming from, how are these customers moving through the most profitable customer journey, how are the clients making money and how can we help them make more money?

(07:37):
Those are the sorts of questions we answer there, and sometimes it gets as specific as, okay, what targeting options are working? And, the other day we had a delicious conversation about targeting options that's working now and I asked Caroline and Amy to have a conversation and record the conversation for us, so that you guys can have a little bit of a fly on the wall, sneak peek into the types of things we talk about in the geeks meeting. And of course, you know that if you want more geek, you need to become a member of the Launch Lounge, and you already know that you can go to shineandsucceed.com/launch to sign up for the wait list, and you want to do that. But before you do that, just have a listen to this episode and find out what targeting options are working right now. Here's Caroline and Amy.

(08:35):
All right, so with all the changes happening in Facebook, Amy and I just wanted to get together and have a chat with you guys about targeting. So, all the options that are available to you in Facebook, but also maybe some of the things you haven't thought of trying, and maybe some things that you used to try and maybe should be trying again and maybe some things you've just never tried before. So, we just wanted to have a quick chat around targeting pretty much. So, Amy, hi.

(09:03):
Hi, how are you?

(09:05):
All right, so I guess really, what are you seeing and where do we want to start? So, do you want to start talking about what we used to do I guess, what we used to do in the good old days?

(09:18):
Yeah, let's start there because some people may be still here. So before all the changes, the iOS, Facebook bringing out all different updates every week, we used to sort of choose our audience size, say two to 6 million. I know it seems a lot, but-

(09:42):
Especially Aussie people.

(09:45):
Yes, it's not easy when you're targeting the US, but two to 6 million was sort of a good sized audience. We would also stack interests, so get all the interest in there, load them up and look-alikes were a lot easier because we've lost a little bit of the tracking, look-alikes are just a little bit harder. So, we're sort of testing lots of things, which we'll probably talk about later anyway. So, that's kind of what we were-

(10:17):
You're right, we used to be very clear on this, like 2.6 million as a sweet spot, and obviously we're talking about cold targeting here, so cold interest targeting, and as you say, stacking all those interests in there. So, maybe you've got digital marketing with copywriting, with social media, everything stacked in there, all the options fall in one asset, but I guess now with the changes and targeting not being as accurate as it used to be, we're testing a few different things. So, you were saying, Amy, that you've been testing actually bigger audiences, bigger than the two to 6 million, so what have you been trying?

(10:55):
Yes, so I've been going broad basically just gender, country, and age-

(11:06):
And no interest in there?

(11:10):
No interest, so we're looking at audiences that can range, depending on the country, from like 10 million, up to 80 million.

(11:19):
Wow.

(11:25):
So, just it's working really well in engagement ads. I have had it work similarly to interest audiences for lead gen. So, it's definitely worth trying. You do need to have good copies, so it's really you want to have strong messaging, really good copy, like an image that's going to stop the scroll for the people. So, basically you're leaving it up to Facebook to find the people that have clicked on something else that your target audience... So, say for example you're looking at a copywriting course and you wanted to go copywriters, no interest in there, but your messaging around this copywriting is so strong that Facebook knows to find copywriters within that big audience.

(12:20):
That makes a lot of sense. I guess before we relied so much on the targeting options available within Facebook, like finding copywriters and now it doesn't know who the copywriters are. So instead of saying, "Oh, ignore that, just go to anyone that lives in this country, that is this age," and using your creative and your copy and your messaging to really actually find the right people, and then the algorithm [inaudible 00:12:44] off the back of that.

(12:44):
It kind of flipped a little bit, hasn't it?

(12:48):
It has, right? I think it used to be almost Facebook's biggest asset was its targeting, but now we're sort of losing that a bit. It's tricky, it's different, and I was just going to ask you though, often we can't actually see the size of audiences in Facebook anymore based on the new privacy and things. What are you doing around that, just guessing?

(13:09):
Sometimes. If you've used an audience before, you'll have an idea as to how big it is. What I'm finding though is if you exclude any... You might exclude people that have already opted into your lead market, that is when you lose the sizing of the audience. So, if you create the audience with the interest first, have a look at what the numbers are there, and then add your exclusions in. You should have an idea as to what size you're targeting.

(13:43):
Cool, good stuff, and I guess just talking about how this now works with the algorithm and the lack of visibility and everything, what if it's a brand new account? The pixel's not been on anywhere pages before, there's no data in the account, there's no campaigns that have ever run, the pixel has zero learning, is it really a good idea to be saying, hey, Facebook, find me the people that you have no clue who they might be? Is it a good idea to be try broad? Would you stay with stacked or look-alikes? Where would you go with it?

(14:14):
I would totally test it. I'm big on testing because you just don't know, and Facebook's AI is getting so clever. I know that I looked [inaudible 00:14:28] one day and I reckon within the next hour after looking at the website or one of posts that popped up on Facebook, I was targeted with like five other ads, different companies selling the similar thing. So, you just have to trust Facebook sometimes. I know it's hard, but test it. See whether it does work for you, and as I said, it's definitely worth putting out at the top of your funnel within engagement. Test it and see how your message is working with people and helping Facebook to find those right people for you.

(15:12):
Definitely-

(15:12):
What do you think?

(15:14):
What do I think?

(15:18):
Yeah, I'm giving it back to you.

(15:19):
Nice-

(15:22):
[inaudible 00:15:22].

(15:23):
No, testing 100%, test it always, and I'd be super cautious with a brand new account if I'm honest. I would probably want to do a little bit of work with some more audiences and things like stacked interest audiences, that kind of thing, especially if also your look-alikes, if you haven't got big, strong custom audiences yet, then your look-alikes aren't necessarily going to work for you either, but I do think there's merit in testing audience sizes 100%. And like you said, with engagement ads, definitely going that bit broader and letting the creative and that messaging do the work for you rather than restricting it almost by giving it these interests, but I think we've seen time and again with accounts that don't have enough data or mojo that need a bit more warming up. So, it's one to be conscious of I guess.

(16:12):
Does it work across all campaign objectives?

(16:15):
Yeah, I liked you were talking about engagement ads earlier and that's obviously a really strong strategy that we use with our clients and students in the Launch Lounge and things, but I think the broad can definitely work. Like I said, an account with some data, with some good mojo, I think it can also work for conversion ads and obviously everything in between, so traffic, video views, anything else you've got in between, but with conversion it's again, it's testing. It's going back to looking at what you've had work in the past and trying new things and seeing if you can get better results with them. So, what else are you testing other than broad?

(16:55):
So, testing like mega stacked audiences, so just going interest based, but just everything, throwing in [inaudible 00:17:05]-

(17:06):
[inaudible 00:17:06] suggestions [inaudible 00:17:06].

(17:06):
That's it, and obviously trying to build up the size of it at the same time. Also look-alikes, so I could know that they're not working as well, so still testing different ones and every account is sort of... Every account needs to test because what works on one doesn't always work across all accounts. So with look-alikes, trying sort of like a bigger look-alike, so instead of 1%, which is obviously the closest to the original source, going bigger, so like 5% can go higher obviously the further away from one you get, the less similar or similarity to the source audience. 3% is kind of a sweet spot.

(18:00):
Yeah, you were saying you like where the 3% is at the moment.

(18:00):
It's a good number. So, I definitely throw in a one and a three just to see you might find the 1% works better, you might find it the 3% works better, and depending on budget, you could try a one, three and a five, depending on how much testing you wanted to go through.

(18:19):
And, one thing we've definitely tried in the past as well is actually a 10%. So like you said, going away from the quality, more towards the quantity to say you've got your email list and you've got a 10% look-alike of your email list. Maybe you've got enough data that you can do a 10% look-alike of your purchases or your clients, and then actually narrowing that down to one really strong interest. So, it might be back to your example earlier, you were selling a copywriting course, so you are targeting copywriters, so you create a 10% look-alike of your email list, and then you say you narrow that down to copywriting or copywriter. So, you pick something that you 100% know is bang on what your avatar are looking for, and then give Facebook that sort of helping hand basically in trying to give it the pools of people you want it to look in.

(19:11):
I like it. I haven't tried that one, so I might have to give that one a go.

(19:15):
I like it. It's smart, and it's using your own data, but also using that interest. So, it's kind of a bit of a combo one, but what about like single interests?

(19:26):
Oh-

(19:26):
[inaudible 00:19:26] stacked, but do you try single interests in one aspect?

(19:30):
Sometimes I do, and it really depends on obviously the size, but if you can find that big, top level interest audience, it can work really well, and then depending on the size of it, you might even just layer it in with page admins. So, let me give you an example. Digital marketing is such a broad topic and covers so many different things. So, you could have digital marketing or you could break it down and you could have copywriting, social media marketing, email marketing, lead gen marketing. You could bring in all these different things that fall under the umbrella of digital marketing, or you could just try digital marketing and see which one works better for [inaudible 00:20:16].

(20:16):
I understand.

(20:17):
Once again, testing.

(20:20):
Testing, testing, testing, test it all, and you mentioned layering as well, which I mentioned with the narrowing of the look-alike down to your one store interest, but in the same way that you are narrowing that audience down.

(20:31):
Yeah, especially if you're dealing with B2B because generally most of them will be a page admin, so you're just narrowing it down. So, instead of getting someone that wants someone to do their social media, you're trying to find someone to... If you went to someone interested in social media, that could be someone that likes Facebook, but you actually want someone that's in business by putting page admin in there as well. They've got a page, so they're at least looking at marketing it.

(21:08):
And, the same way you could select business owners or something like that, small business owners [inaudible 00:21:14]-

(21:12):
Founders-

(21:12):
Trying new layers.

(21:23):
Definitely, there's lots in there and you just find that sweet spot that works. So, there's lots to test with as well.

(21:29):
There always is. I guess one big change as well that... Oh, when even was it? I don't know, in six months, 12 months, probably more than that, but detailed targeting expansion. I feel like this has been a bit of a game changer in how we target and these sizes of audiences that we create, and I remember when it very first came out, our initial reaction was like, "Don't touch it, leave it off, control your audience. Otherwise, how do who you're trying to target?" But now, oh wait, for some people it's actually on by default, but now we use it quite a lot. What are your thoughts on detailed targeting expansion?

(22:04):
Look, sometimes it helps. If you have an interest and you know that it's only these particular three things that you're targeting, you can turn it on and let Facebook find people similar to that because maybe they're clicking on things that they haven't actually said I'm interested in, but Facebook can see what they're interested in. So, it can definitely help, and it also makes your audience a bit bigger, which Facebook likes at the moment. So, I feel like it's a little, here's a reward for doing what we want you to do.

(22:40):
I think it comes with that caveat as well, doesn't it? It says it will only go broader than what you specify if it leads to better results.

(22:48):
Yes.

(22:49):
How much do we trust that? We're not sure, but like you said... And, I think in some accounts it's actually on by default, you can't change it. So, if you are [inaudible 00:23:00] it's on, then it's on, and I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing now-

(23:06):
No, I wouldn't worry too much either.

(23:09):
Definitely.

(23:10):
Roll with it.

(23:12):
Some look-alike expansion as well, that was rolled out... I'm probably talking about two years now, isn't it? Time is just crazy, but anyway-

(23:24):
[inaudible 00:23:24]. That's probably newer than the detail. The detail targeting has been there, but not as it has to be on, whereas it's rolling out, but it has to be on and then look-alike expansion. I haven't seen any that it's set like it's an option, like it-

(23:40):
[inaudible 00:23:40].

(23:40):
It's [inaudible 00:23:43] somewhere.

(23:44):
Audience expansion coming to custom audiences, which I think we've got interesting thoughts on that, but that's probably another episode, which we won't talk about today, but watch your space if you do end up with an option to be able to put targeting expansion on your custom audiences and probably check it's not on by default because that would maybe mark up some of your retargeting. And, talking of retargeting and warm audiences, we're focused a lot on cold with interest, with broad, with look-alike, and what about retargeting? We've already chat about iOS and visibility being down and privacy rules up and obviously leading to smaller audiences that we now have to retarget, but what are you seeing working with retargeting?

(24:27):
So, obviously the smaller audiences are a bit harder. Previously, we rely on the pixel to track people who have been to the website, but now we don't necessarily see all that information. So, it's a bit harder to create audiences to retarget that way. So, it's kind getting creative and working out other ways that we can catch those people to retarget them. I've been doing a lot with sort of on-platform engagement, so using engagement ads, video views, ads, and just retargeting anything that happens on the platform, and there's quite a few ways that you can do that too. So, it kind of seems to be working quite well. It's also a great way to warm people up just to bring them into your funnel if they haven't had too many touch points. So, it's something that I'm definitely implementing and I think something that we teach as well in terms of having an engagement ad running. It also helps with like account mojo. So, it's like a win-win.

(25:38):
So, obviously keeping people on the platform, keeping them on the Facebook app or Instagram app by using objectives like videos views, engagement, [inaudible 00:25:49] those buckets of people and to be able to retarget them rather than just-

(25:56):
You can also retarget anyone that's filled in a lead gen form on Facebook, anyone that's opened an instant experience and you can go into that and it actually allows you to pick if they've opened it, but not opted in. So, there's a few options in there, so I highly recommend going in and having a look at custom audiences that you can create and seeing what on-platform ones are in there to use.

(26:26):
It seems that Facebook want us to do this as well. It's the direction they want us to go in because they have more data and then they can better optimize your campaigns and then you can get better results, and then you keep advertising and you keep giving them money.

(26:40):
And, they don't want you to leave the platform. So, it's kind of like working with them.

(26:45):
Win-win, 100%. So, I guess the other one in terms of retargeting is email list as well. You want to build your email list, audience build lists as well, and then once you have your email list, you upload it back into Facebook and retarget that are on your list, say you're launching your course or whatever it might be, but I guess-

(27:06):
How many people do you need on the list now?

(27:10):
On the email list? That's a tricky one. It used to be that we could have like 100 people on the list and you could upload it back into Facebook and you could get back in front of them, and you can retarget them, but now it feels like you need more like 1,000, which especially if you're just starting out, you might not have 1,000 people on that list, and even if you are more established in business and you've got great big lists, but there might just be a certain segment that you want to retarget, there's not often 1,000 people in that.

(27:37):
So, I would suggest upload them, see what it says, and what error if it's not enough people. See what it says, really try and create a look-alike from it as well, but do just test what you have. And if you need to, you can always use your list in conjunction with pixel data. So, look at your lead event fires and include those people in that audience as well. So, it's definitely something you need to still do, definitely still be using your lists for your custom audiences, but just be aware you might need a few more people than we used to be able to create that audience, which is just again, a testament to big audiences, and Facebook wanting more and more people in these audiences they're targeting.

(28:17):
Absolutely. What about researching, like finding our audience? How do we do that? We need to know kind of what they're interested in. Have you got any tips on that?

(28:29):
We used to use, what was it, Audience Insights before that went away-

(28:33):
Yes, it seems so long ago now.

(28:36):
Just click the button and you can see absolutely everything, but with privacy the way it is, that's not a feature anymore. So, we have to get a bit more creative, I guess, but using Amazon, Google, YouTube, they're all good platforms to go and look at what your ideal clients are interested in. So, just have a look and they can also help inform things like copy as well. So, it's definitely worth diving down, and I'm really strong on just going back to your ICA, your ideal client, and looking at that avatar sort of piece of information on them, like what stage of life are they at? What are they doing? What's their lifestyle? Are they into health and fitness food? What else are they doing in their lives? It doesn't have to just be what it is about that course that you're selling to them, it can be all other aspects of their life and it might then trigger up some other great ideas that, I don't know, maybe if they're a bit older and they're in different categories, what else are they also doing with their life?

(29:30):
Are they looking at pensions? Are they looking at investment properties? That might have nothing to do with your course, but if they're in that age and they're sort of interested and lets someone target it, it could work really well for you. I think, Amy, you mentioned earlier with entrepreneurs, often we think about, are they interested in digital marketing, like Facebook advertising, all these things? Mindset, but Netflix [inaudible 00:29:54]-

(29:54):
Yes.

(29:55):
[inaudible 00:29:55] and they're watching Netflix as well, so really do go back to that works that you've done in who you're targeting, and then think about how that plays out in the interest you want to target in Facebook as well-

(30:07):
Yes, I've got another little trick that when you see an ad, like there's three little dots at the top. If you click on that, it'll open up and you can click on the why am I seeing this, so that's another way to do some research because if that ad is something that you're selling, then you want to know what they're targeting because then you can target that also. It's a great little trick.

(30:34):
Very sneaky. I wrote in one of our ad updates the other week about how you can actually see what interests Facebook think you have as well. I thought it was so interesting, but you can go and see what your interests are according to Facebook, and then that's what you get targeted ads with based on those. But, you can actually go and call them if you want, so you could change up your whole entire interests and just be like, "No, I'm not interested in any of that anymore. I'm done." All very good ways to research and I guess all that said, just go research, research, test, test, test, and then if it doesn't work, what do you do if it doesn't work?

(31:12):
No, change something. No, seriously, it's all about testing. So if it's not working, have a look at the audiences. Are you testing a few? Is there one that's working better? Can you break that down? Can you try something similar to it? Tweak it, run it again, see what happens, and then I guess at the end of the day, if you try multiple audiences and nothing is working, it may not be the audience that's the issue. It might come back to your messaging or your hook or your offer, and that's when you have to go back to the drawing board, look at your creatives, look at the data that you've got as well, and a whole other episode right there, and just make... It's kind of like make those changes, but if it's not working and you've tried multiple audiences, there's something else that needs to change.

(32:20):
100%, awesome. Well, I hope there's some good food for thought for everyone there, and a lot of things to try and test, test, test as always.

(32:28):
Yes, absolutely.

(32:30):
Right, thanks, Amy.

(32:31):
That's my favorite word, no worries.

(32:35):
Excellent.

(32:36):
Thanks, Caroline.

(32:38):
Bye.

(32:39):
Well, thank you very much, Caroline and Amy. I hope that you just learned a whole lot of new things about how to find your best audiences using Facebook and Instagram ads, and remember, hit reply to the email in your inbox. Come and talk to me, tell me what you think about this episode. If you haven't yet subscribed, get on the wait list for the Launch Lounge and then you're on my email list and you will get emails about fabulous, fantastic episodes we have coming up in The Shine Show. That's it from me and Team Shine, Team Launch Lounge, I will catch you again next week, bye.

(33:24):
If you loved this episode and you are a committed online course launcher who wants to learn how to grow your profits in your next course launch, and you want to know how to successfully scale your online courses business to seven figures and beyond, then I'd love to see you inside the Launch Lounge. The Launch Lounge is the only community online that is dedicated solely to helping you develop every aspect of your online courses business, so that you can build your business to scale with no one size fits all solutions, just the right education you need when you need it, coaching from our team of experts in different areas of launching and scaling and the best community on the internet. The Launch Lounge is your online course building home if you want profitable launches that scale your business to seven figures and beyond. To get on the wait list for our next enrollment season, go to shineandsucceed.com/launch. Thank you so much for listening. If you had fun, please come back next week and remember to hit that subscribe button, so you never miss a thing.

163. How To Transition Out Of 1-1 Work Without Losing Income

05 July 2022 | By Salome Schillack

listen now:

Nothing is more glorious than leaping from the 1-1, saying goodbye to locked in meetings and waving hello to the fat wallet, flexi schedule, online course creator life.

Boy, oh boy, is that an exciting place to be. Sweet, sweet freedom to block off time for holidays, to be there to pick your kids up from school, to watch the school play, to see them race at the sports carnival.

But, putting the realist hat on for a sec, how do you make it happen? And how do you make it happen smoothly?

Jump too soon; your income will take a serious hit….

Jump too late; the momentum you worked hard to build could slip through your fingers.

My friend, I have good news for you. There is a proven roadmap to successfully emerging from your coaching cocoon and transforming into the spectacular, multi-figure online course creator butterfly you've dreamt of being.

Wanna know how?

This week on The Shine Show, I share the step-by-step how I took to leap from mostly 1-1 work, to being a full-fledged online course creator with an extra $200k landing in my bank account while I sipped Pina Coladas by the pool - for real!

I'll reveal the whole process, from who to hire, when to outsource, knowing if it's the right time, what I wish I had done earlier, and so much more.

Grab a pen so you don’t miss the actionable steps you can take right now that'll set you up for a smooth transition.

XXX

Salome

Subscribe and Review in iTunes Please!

When you subscribe and review the podcast not only does that give me the warm and fuzzies all over, it also helps other people to find the show.

When other people find the show they get to learn how to create more freedom in their lives from their online courses too!!

So do a good deed for all womenkind and subscribe and review this show and I will reward you with a shout out on the show!!

Links I mentioned in this episode:

Scroll down for a full transcript of this episode

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173. 3 Reasons NOW Is The Best Time To Start A Digital Courses Business with Amy Porterfield

172. 25 Biggest Lessons In Online Marketing I Learned From Amy Porterfield

171. Social Media: One Thing That Makes All The Effort Worthwhile

170. How to Choose the Right Name for Your Online Course

169. Content Planning For Posts VS Content For Your Course And Launches

168. Managing Your Money As A Small Business Owner with Darcie Milfeld

167. 3 Lies You Were Told About Hiring An Ads Manager

166. How To Create Your Online Course Faster with Gina Onativia

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164. New Ad Targeting Options That Are Working Now

TRANSCRIPT

Hello, and welcome to episode number 163 of The Shine Show. Today's episode is called How to Transfusion Out of one-on-one Work Without Losing Income, and I share with you a little bit of my own experience. Giving up your time and freedom to make money is so 2009. Hi, I'm your host Salome Schillack, and I help online course creators launch, grow and scale their businesses with Facebook and Instagram ads so that they can make more money and have an even bigger impact in the world.

If you're ready to be inspired, to dream bigger, launch sooner and grow your online business faster, then tune in because you are ready to shine, and this is The Shine Show. Hello my dear friend, it is lovely to be here with you. It's Saturday morning here in Brisbane and the sun is shining. It's a little cool outside, it's winter here in Australia and my family, and I just got back from the most magnificent 10 days in Fiji.

If you have never been to Fiji, put that on your bucket list. The postcards are accurate, it is just an absolute paradise, and I'm so grateful to be back here with you. I have rested, it's amazing for me to see how my creativity and my ability to problem solve just a hundred times. It explodes when I come back from a holiday. It really, really does matter that we switch off and that we learn to look after our brains.

I had such a wonderful, wonderful time just clearing my mind from the clutter. Highly recommend it. If you can, book some time away today, it really makes a difference. Okay, today, I am going to tell you the story of how I transitioned out of mostly one-on-one work into one to many work. A lot of you are still working as coaches. You may be agency owners like me or freelancers or done for you specialists or consultants. Maybe like me, you started out as a Facebook Ads Manager, and you are looking to turn your business into a one to many model which is why you're here, and which is why you want to learn more about launching an online courses business with me here.

Now, I will say that I still bring in I would say at this point of time, maybe two-thirds of our income in Shine And Succeed Pty Ltd which is the business that I run is two-thirds of it is still income coming in from our clients, our one-on-one clients in the agency. And another I would say at this stage, oh goodness me, you would think, I'm not telling you the truth. We're leaning towards half-half. Every month is a little bit different, but on some months, it's two thirds, one-on-one, one-third online courses, and other months, it is kind of getting close to being half-half which makes me really happy because in the agency side of the business where we work with people one-on-one, where I work with them one-on-one, but my team also does a ton of work in the background for them, we only need a handful of clients to bring in two-thirds of our income which sounds incredible.

It is if you think about only needing a handful of clients to make a large amount of money, that is wonderful. And we definitely are incredibly lucky to have been able to build it that way, but there's a lack of security in that. I have a team of people that I have to hire that has to be available. So it's not just contractors, it is employees and it is semi-permanent contractors that I have an agreement with to pay them every month, but clients come and go and, it's not always as easy to get a client as it is to get a few more students inside a course.

So in order to mitigate that risk, it is important that even if you want to hang onto your one-on-one clients like I do, that you balance that out with some one to many work. It's also good for your sanity because you will possibly lose your mind if you are only working with one-on-one clients, and you're the only person doing all of the work there. So I do want you to substitute your income even if you love one-on-one. And even if you're okay with the ups and downs of the income from one-on-one work, I do still want you to work on getting your one to many model, one to many your courses launched, or even group coaching programs launched because it does provide more stability.

It also gives you the power. If we've seen anything from COVID, we've got to build our businesses for pivot. Do you also see Ross pulling a couch up a stairway when I say the word pivot? I still see that picture of Ross and the couch pivot, pivot. If I'm seeing one thing, it is the world is changing faster I feel, and maybe I'm right, maybe I'm wrong about this, but I feel like it's changing faster than it used to.

And maybe that's because of the speed of the just information models changing, this handful of big companies that we are at the mercy of with our online course businesses, Facebook, Apple, Apple makes one decision one day and the next day, the algorithm changes, and it impacts the algorithm, it impacts the pixel and suddenly advertising is different and we all have to adapt to that, and then we all run back to social media and organic, but we also have to be able to adapt for that.

And so I am all for building sustainable businesses that are built for growth, built for profitable and predictable scaling, not for throwing a lot of spaghetti on the wall in one or two places, and then publishing those results and telling everyone how this is the new magic pill. Well, I think you know that about me already. Okay, so let me tell you how I did it, and then I'm going to give you some step by steps for how you can do it, and then you're off to the races my friend.

Then you will have pretty much a step by step method for how you can bring more one to many work into your business, into your life and how you can do it in three to six months and what you can expect it to look like in about a year. So at the beginning of 2018, I quit my job. I had just been to San Diego to Amy Porterfield's B-School live event, met my mentor, Rick Mulready there, I met James Wedmore there, I met Jasmine Star, I met Pat Flynn. I'm trying to think who else was there.

I met Amy, of course, was introduced to Amy, and she is as lovely as you think she is. She's just the warmest, most wonderful person. And I signed up for clients for my Facebook Ads Freelancing Ads Manager Business. Came home, gave my boss the bird and started freelancing at the beginning of 2018. Now, this was three years into trying to build a business. I had already launched an online course that I thought had failed, it hadn't. I had already done social media to the point of burnout multiple times.

I had been on every platform available to mankind. I had tried every tactic, I had bought every online course. I had burnt out, gone back to my day job and realized no day job is definitely not what I want. I had come back from $40,000 of debt. So January 2018 really was a pivotal moment for me. Suddenly, everything I had worked so hard for three years started working. It started paying off and all of the knowledge I collected over the three years, I was able to pour into helping other online course builders run ads.

I also did some other marketing work for them. Suddenly I realized I had a skill like building a webinar for someone that I had developed, and there are people who have $2 million businesses who don't know how to build a webinar. Who's happy to pay for things like that. So 2018 was mostly made up of making money from whatever my skills were I could sell to any online course creator who was willing to buy from me.

I also really built my systems and processes for running ads. And so by the end of 2018, I was able to hire ... Initially I hired three people on hourly rates to help me run ads. I think I had 12 clients at that point, managing them all by myself. And I hired three ads managers to help me while I was going to go on holiday for six weeks with my family. I learned a lot about hiring people, learned a lot about firing people, and learned a lot about keeping people accountable during that holiday, but that's a story for another day.

One of those three people was Caroline, and Caroline is still in my business. Caroline is the person who writes the monthly Facebook Ad update that if you are one of our clients, if you're one of The Launch Lounge students or an A-Lister student, you would get this monthly report that tells you exactly what is the lay of the land in Facebook Ads world. At the moment, Caroline is one of the members of the geek team in my business.

She's one of our main geeks. We proudly refer to ourselves as geeks because we geek out to a degree that is laughable on some techy stuff and on funnels and on marketing, all things, online course marketing. So Caroline was one of the people who joined me at the end of 2018, and that meant that most of 2019 was spent working with Caroline, and I also then hired Hannah who is my absolute work wife. Hannah is one of the cornerstones pillars of Shine and Succeed, and she has just the most incredible brain.

She is the geek of all geeks, and that girl can do data and analytics and create a story for what your data and analytics tells you like nobody can. I am the luckiest person ever to have Caroline and Hannah in my business. And I'm sure my clients agree that Caroline and Hannah are both worth their white and gold. So in 2019, I started handing off all the work to Caroline and Hannah to the point where by the end of 2019, Caroline and Hannah were doing pretty much, most of the day to day client work with the exception of sales calls.

I was still doing all the sales calls and I was still taking the one-on-one calls with the clients because we were based we're based in Australia, as you know, and most of our clients are in the US. And so I was the only one who could really talk to them sometimes at four o'clock in the morning. And so I would have the strategy calls with the clients and then Caroline and Hannah would execute the work. And I realized towards the end of 2019 that that really gives me freedom to start focusing on diversifying the business and to start focusing on bringing in additional income streams so that I can mitigate risk.

And so that we don't have to rely on a handful of people to pay all of our salaries that if we lose some clients, we don't necessarily lose income. We have some other income streams that we can leverage to make some money. At the end of 2019, I started growing my email list. I knew I had to build an email list, but I knew it conceptually, but I didn't know it in my bones despite the fact that everyone who's successful tells you to build your list, I knew it conceptually, but I did not know it in my bones.

Today, I know that I have to build my email list in my bones because I have seen the absolute magic of having a responsive email list who adores you, who engages with you and who wants to hear from you and who wants to buy from you. If you take one thing away from this message today, I want that to be build your email list. Okay, so I started building my email list towards the end of 2019, and I launched the podcast.

I knew that I need content. I need free content to go out every single week. I also knew that I did not want to fall into another social media hustle. I had done the social media hustles in the first three years when my business failed to the bitter end, and I was just so over doing a social media hustle. So maybe I didn't know this at the time, I know it now. I can now look back and say there's definitely two types of content. One is large format content content, I have spoken about this on other episodes, and one is small format content.

Large format content is your podcast, your blog or your video blog or yeah, it's written, it's recorded in large format, or it's recorded in audio, video blog or a podcast. Now you can have that video on YouTube which is great and it qualifies the social media, but I still count a YouTube channel as larges format because people can binge and they can consume a lot of content, but a podcast, a blog or a video blog is your large format content, and those pieces of content really are your most important pieces of content.

Social media is small form, and those small form platforms really only serve one of two purposes. It's to get people to your large format content, or to get them onto your list, that's the only two things that they serve. So I'm going to go deeper into this. I'm getting sidetracked here. I started the podcast at the end of 2019, and I just started speaking. I just started podcasting, and by January 2020, I knew that adding podcasting and sending weekly emails and having consistent list building activities, publishing the podcast, marketing the podcast, driving people from social media to the podcast, driving people from social media to the email list, all of that required a lot of work, and so I hired Ashley.

Ashley was a VA, I would say a high level VA to help me with the marketing. And I had already started working on A-Lister when COVID hit. I was launching A-Lister right as COVID hit. And within 12 months of starting to sell to my list, I made $200,000 from A-Lister and The Launch Lounge combined. Now, I want you to think about that. The financial stability that that creates when you can add $200,000 in a year to your income by doing the same thing over and over and over again, it's not like client work where even though you're doing the same thing, you have to do it from scratch every time.

It is you do something from scratch once, and then you rinse and repeat, rinse and repeat, rinse and repeat. And within 12 months I had added $200,000 to my income, to the business's income with A-Lister and The Launch Lounge which really set me up well for 2021 when I started massively expanding my team and massively building out the course's side of our business, and I wish I can tell you what we're working on right now. You are in for a treat.

All I can say is buckle up because you are about to see the courses and membership side of this business really, really take off, but more about that on another podcast when I have some more concrete things to show you, but let me just say, I'm doing a lot of stuff behind the scenes that you're going to want to see. Okay, so how are we going to do this? What is the step by step?

You must be thinking, "Okay, thanks Salome, I love hearing your story, but give me this step by step. Tell me what I need to do if I'm going to transition from one-on-one work to one to many work or to building a more sustainable, scalable business with online courses." And I'm going to give you five steps. Now, let me give you, I'm going to give you the five steps and then I'm going to take them one by one and unpack them a little bit, and then I'll recap the five steps, and then you're on your own, then you're going to have to go and implement them.

And of course, I would love, love to hear from you either on Insta, DM me or send me an email at hello@shineandsucceed.com, and tell me what your plan is for shifting over from one-on-one work to one to many work. Okay, here's number one, step number one. Have you got your pain in your paper ready? Step number one, identify the work in your one-on-one business only you can do and hand the rest off.

Step number two, build a platform for your large format free content. Step number three, build your list. Step number four, pre-launch your course before you build it. And step number five is take your student's feedback and create your best value course that you can sell with the lowest amount of work at the highest possible price. Those are your five steps. Now, let's take them one by one and unpack them a little bit.

Let's talk about identify the work in your one-on-one business only you can do in handing the rest of it off. I realized when I hired Caroline and Hannah, there were a few things that only I could do at that point in time, I was the only one who could do strategy. I was the only one who understood both online course funnels and Facebook Ads. Today, I think Caroline and Hannah knows more about that than me, but back then, I was the only one who could do that.

So I had to work with them to teach them how to marry the relationship between Facebook Ads and online courses. And I had to meet with the clients to do strategy. I was the only person who could do creative quality control. So advertising and basically marketing is creative communication. It's the reason I love it so much. It's my musical theater days that I just cannot put it behind me.

I love creative communication, and I love seeing how you can take people on a journey with creative communication, advertising and launching and funnel building is nothing other than creative communication, and sometimes, people forget that an ad does not exist in a vacuum. An email does not exist in a vacuum. Sales page does not exist in a vacuum, a webinar does not exist in a vacuum.

There is a thread in all of it that runs through all of it. So creative quality control was something I knew I was the only person who could do that because I was the only person with the big picture for the clients. And with the ability to connect the dots between the strategy, the ads and the creative. I was also the only one who could take client meetings. I was the only one who was willing to get up at 4:00 a.m. or 3:00 a.m., sometimes 2:00 a.m., yes there were 2:00 a.m. calls to talk to clients in the US, and I had my life arranged around that.

Whereas Caroline's kids were still quite little and she lived in Perth, so the timezone was an issue. And Hannah, I had to protect Hannah from clients. Hannah doesn't love working with clients which is great because she's really good at other things. So I realized that strategy, creative quality control, and client meetings were the only things I could do. I also realized I did not need to do any admin. I was not going to continue to do any project management.

I stopped creating reports and sending out reports. I stopped setting up ads, I stopped managing ads, I stopped scaling ads. Basically I stopped using the ads manager for the clients. Now, that was a big one to let go. I think it took me a proper year to really fully let go of that one because I thought this is a Facebook Ads business, so therefore I must do Facebook Ads. Today, I can honestly say, I think I have students who are more comfortable inside the ads manager than I am because I only go in there every now and then, and every time I do, it's changed, but the one thing that I still do better than everyone else is strategy and creative communication. That is just where I shine.

And so that is what I do and everything else I've handed off to other people. What I did have to do that I didn't know at that stage was develop my leadership skills to support Caroline and Hannah, to be able to learn and make decisions based on the needs of our clients. Leadership takes up a lot of time and you have to know that you're stepping up into becoming a CEO, a leader, and a manager, even when you hand off responsibilities to other people.

So make a list of your one-on-one business and the tasks that only you can do and then start brainstorming what everything else is that you can hand off to someone else. And if it scares you, you're doing it right, it is scary. So number one is identify the work in your one-on-one business. Only you can do in hand off the rest. Number two, build a platform for your large format free content.

In my case, that was a podcast. What I don't want you to do is to start hustling on social media. That is absolutely the last thing you as the CEO of your business and the keeper of the high level strategy information or strategic information should be doing. Social media is a beautiful, powerful tool that relies 100% on your energy to grow. It is a monster that needs feeding and that feeding can pie off really well if you love it and you can sustain it, but the only real purpose of social media is to drive people to your long form content, your podcast, your blog, or your videos to get people to your website and to get people onto your email list, and don't ever forget that social media is not a means in itself.

You only need social media to drive people to that long form content. All of which should be sitting on your website and be optimized for SEO. If you love social media, go for it, but always know that social media is a means to an end, and that end is building your list and driving more people to consume your larger content. Your fans are the ones who listen, who learn and who read, not the ones who double clicks likes, and then continue scrolling.

Do you hear me on that? Your fans are the ones who listen, learn and read, not the ones who hit like and keep scrolling. Now, I know it can be a bit scary when you start planning large format content. When I started the podcast, I had already tried my hand at video blogging and I enjoyed that, I really did, but I felt that I needed a larger, I needed something longer than five or seven minutes to communicate what I want to communicate.

Here, this episode is 27 minutes long so far, you know I love to talk. So I decided I'm going to go more casual and do podcasting. And I, of course immediately all the imposter syndrome stuff came up. So what I decided because I'd already done video blogging, I'd already tried blogging. I had already done, the shine show was originally a Facebook live broadcast that went for an hour long once a week. I'd already done that, and I decided because I had done it and given up on it, I didn't want this to be a do and give up on situation.

I just decided I'm going to do this, and I'm just going to close my eyes and run into it and embrace it and do it as well as I can for as long as I can without judging it. So I made a decision. I made a commitment to myself that I will not make a call on whether or not the podcast, whether the podcast is good or not until I hit 100 episodes. I just said, "I am going to give myself 100 episodes completely judgment free and see what happens."

I didn't want to subject myself to my own brain giving me 700 reasons why it wouldn't be good enough. I'd been there too many times before with the live broadcasting and the vlogging. And I just decided that, "Well, who am I to decide whether my podcast is good enough anyway?" So I want you to let all of your not good enough thoughts be there if they come up for you. Just sit with them and just watch them appear without personalizing them. It is just your brain doing what your brain is supposed to do when it detects danger and you are in danger, but it's not real danger.

It's pretend danger. Let's call it pretend danger because you are making yourself vulnerable. You are being judged by others. Let's not even mince words about that. Let's not even say what if people judge me, people are going to judge you and that's okay because you know what? People are judging you whether you do it or not. People are judging you every day for things that you don't even think that they are, and it doesn't bother you then, so don't let it bother you when you're doing big things.

You must still do it, that is the way. So sit down, decide which large format you're going to create. Video blogging, podcasting or blogging, reading, watching, or listening. One of those three. I don't know about another one yet. If there's another one, let me know. You can either write a blog, you can record a video blog or a video of some kind, think Marie Forleo and the MarieTV or podcasting like I do.

So step number two is build your platform on your large free content. Step number three is build your list and build your list, build your list, build your list, build your list. I wish I started this sooner. All the time, you should be building your list. Use ads, use ads, use ads, use ads. It is the easiest way to build an audience without selling your soul on social media. It can be cheap.

It is not cheap when you follow shitty advice and you throw spaghetti on the wall and you do all sorts of different fly by night strategies, then it's not cheap because then you're just making Zuckerberg richer. It is cheap. If you have $5 a day, you run engagement ads and talk about your lead magnets on your socials. If you have $15 a day, you run lead gen ads that are cheaper than conversion ads. Might not give you the best quality lead, but it will build your list, and if you have $25 a day, you run conversion ads, that'll get you good quality leads and they will open your emails.

So I have talked about all of these strategies, the $5 a day engagement strategy, lead gen ads and list building strategies to ... There are hundreds of hours of podcast content created for you about that. So just go to shineandsucceed.com, find the podcast page and dive in there if you want to learn more about building your list with any of these three strategies. Really if I shout it from the rooftops, it's one of those funny things that sometimes you may have noticed, I'm moving away from talking about Facebook Ads the whole time because my mission is just so much bigger.

It started with Facebook Ads, but now, my mission really is to help women use their knowledge and their skills to build wealth because when women have money, the world is a better place. So Facebook ads just seem like such a small part of that, but if you want to learn about those Facebook Ad strategies, they're all on the podcast, you can just go there and listen, and you will hear all about it. Of course, these are also strategies we go deep in with our students inside The Launch Lounge and inside A-Lister as well.

So don't forget to sign up for the white list. If you want to find out when The Launch Lounge opens again, and you can do that by going to shineandsucceed.com/launch. So step number three is build your list. Step number four is pre-launch your course before you build it. This is often called a founding member's launch or a pre-launch or a beta launch, and I will tell you the happiest day of my journey as an online course builder, a marketer and a launcher was the day I sent three emails to my list and I made a thousand dollars.

It was the first time I felt so empowered, and I finally understood what people meant when they said it can be easy to make money on the internet. Before that, it being easy was not my experience. Everything felt hard. Creating a webinar felt hard. Running ads felt hard. Doing sales felt hard. Building the course felt hard, but before all of this, I did not have a podcast and I did not have a list, and now I did. And now, strangers were reading an email from me every week.

Now, strangers were getting to know me. Now, strangers were learning with me and from me, and they weren't telling me that they were doing all these things. So I still felt like I was talking to myself most of the time until I sent the first email to say, "I'm starting a membership. Do you want in?" I didn't even know what was going to be in the membership. I just told them, "You get first dips, the best price, and we're going to hang out together once a week." And they wanted that, they wanted in, it was like magic.

Once you have an audience of about a thousand people and they get a weekly email from you with a podcast, a video or a blog post that adds value to them, then you'll be amazed at how easy it becomes to transition from one-on-one to one to many. So step number four is pre-launch your course before you build it. Step number five is take your students feedback and create your best value course that you can sell with the lowest amount of work and the highest possible price.

Now, once you have worked with that first batch of students for let's say six to 12 weeks, you send out a survey to them. And some of the things that you want to ask them is why did you sign up to this? What was your pain point? What were you struggling with before coming into this program? And then you want to know how do you want that to be? What is your goal? What does it look like when it is exactly the way you want it to be?

And what they're going to share with you is their pain in their language and their desire in their language. And that my friend is the copy for your sales bite, your webinar, your emails, for everything that comes in your next launch. That is the copy that you use to base the promise of your course on. That is the copy that you use to connect with them and show them that you understand the problem they have, you have a solution for it, and you understand the desired end result they want.

And when you can have all of that in place, then you build the best course possible to get them that end result. And you sell it at the highest price you can because you have proof of concept, because you have proof of the offer working, because you will have testimonials, because you have evidence of it working for some other people. And that is the five steps to transitioning from one-on-one work into one to many work without losing income. The transition doesn't have to be hard, there really is a recipe, and if you work the recipe, you can start successfully making that transition within three to six months.

And within a year, you can also look back and say, "Wow, I've added $200,000 to my income without working any harder." I love sharing this journey with you. I love telling you my story and sharing with you, pulling back the curtain and showing you the good, bad, and the ugly of my journey, and I share all of that here on the podcast. What I would love to ask you is if you love the podcast and you have some other friends who would also benefit from listening to this, all of those people in the online courses with you, your mastermind at your online course building buddies, share the podcast with them.

I would really appreciate it, and if you want to write and review on Apple, that would also make me super happy. Thank you so much for listening. I love hanging out with you. Have a wonderful week. I'll see you next week. If you love this episode and you are a committed online course launcher who wants to learn how to grow your profits in your next course launch, and you want to know how to successfully scale your online courses, business to seven figures and beyond, then I'd love to see you inside The Launch Lounge.

The Launch Lounge is your online course building home if you want profitable launches that scale your business to seven figures and beyond. To get on the wait list for our next enrollment season, go to shineandsucceed.com/launch. Thank you so much for listening. If you had fun, please come back next week, and remember to hit that subscribe button so you never miss a thing.

162. What To Do When You Don’t Like Your Business Anymore

162. What To Do When You Don't Like Your Business Anymore

28 June 2022 | By Salome Schillack

listen now:

I'm about to admit something big.

There have been times when I totally lost my passion for my business.

**gasp**

I know, not everyone will admit to it, but you know I keep things real.

There have been moments where I got sidetracked by so many shiny objects because they seemed more fun.

There have even been times I felt I would rather watch another episode of Real Housewives than answer another email.

Recently I had a huge epiphany that changed everything for me, and if you've at times lost your mojo, it's going to help you too.

I used to think all the external factors caused this burnout and exhaustion.

Too many meetings, not enough time or money… you know the old lines we all have running in our minds when we are tired and stressed.

And…..it dawned on me. My burnout has nothing to do with the external factors.

You could land a job as a full-time chocolate taste tester or a professional shoe shopper, but if you don’t tackle those internal issues, everywhere you go, they’ll pop up and steal your joy!

So what do you do when you start feeling blah about your business? How exactly can we deal with the internal stuff?

You'll have to tune into this week's episode of The Shine Show to find out.

If you're walking in circles, always coming back to the same frustration, the same exhaustion, the same belief that once you get to your next goal, you'll be happy...stop what you are doing because this episode is especially for you.

Xxx

Salome

PS: Want to grow your profits in your next launch or scale up fast? The Launch Lounge is the best community on the internet for online course creators. Inside you’ll find industry experts dedicated to helping you grow every aspect of your business with no one size fits all solutions (we all know they don’t work). Doors are opening soon for a limited intake. Join the waitlist here.

Subscribe and Review in iTunes Please!

When you subscribe and review the podcast not only does that give me the warm and fuzzies all over, it also helps other people to find the show.

When other people find the show they get to learn how to create more freedom in their lives from their online courses too!!

So do a good deed for all womenkind and subscribe and review this show and I will reward you with a shout out on the show!!

Links I mentioned in this episode:

Scroll down for a full transcript of this episode

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174. Some Thoughts On Making Lots Of Money

173. 3 Reasons NOW Is The Best Time To Start A Digital Courses Business with Amy Porterfield

172. 25 Biggest Lessons In Online Marketing I Learned From Amy Porterfield

171. Social Media: One Thing That Makes All The Effort Worthwhile

170. How to Choose the Right Name for Your Online Course

169. Content Planning For Posts VS Content For Your Course And Launches

168. Managing Your Money As A Small Business Owner with Darcie Milfeld

167. 3 Lies You Were Told About Hiring An Ads Manager

166. How To Create Your Online Course Faster with Gina Onativia

165. The Only Way Low Dollar Offers Are Working Today

164. New Ad Targeting Options That Are Working Now

TRANSCRIPT

Hello, and welcome to episode number 162 of The Shine Show. Today, we're going to unpack and explore what to do when you don't like your business anymore. Giving up your time and freedom to make money is so 2009. Hi, I'm your host, Salome Schillack, and I help online course creators launch, grow, and scale their businesses with Facebook and Instagram ads so that they can make more money and have an even bigger impact in the world. If you're ready to be inspired, to dream bigger, launch sooner, and grow your online business faster, then tune in because you are ready to shine, and this is The Shine Show.

Hello, my friend. How are you this week? I will tell you, winter has come here in Brisbane. It is cold today. I have the heater running in my office because down under, it's winter right now, so if you're in the Northern Hemisphere and you're chilling poolside, just know that I am very jealous.

Now, I know that I get to enjoy summer pool weather for about nine months of the year, so I can let you have your few months, but I will complain when it's cold, and I was not built for cold. Today's episode is an episode about passion, and it is an episode about joy. I hope that at the end of this episode, you will walk away from it, feeling seen and heard if you have lost a little bit of your passion and joy for your business. I also hope that if you find yourself in a bit of a rut, maybe you don't quite feel disconnected from your business, but maybe you just feel a bit meh about your business at the moment, or maybe your income has plateaued, your launches are staying the same size, they're not getting any bigger, and you just kind of keep doing the same thing, getting the same results, and it's maybe a bit boring, or maybe it's just not giving you the energy it used to give you. If that's how you feel, then today's episode is for you, and I hope that you will leave here feeling energized, feeling like you have a few tools in your toolbox to go and make some hard choices, to find your passion and your joy in your business again.

I have, for as long as I can remember, wanted to stand on a stage and speak. I was a comedian when I was a kid. Carol Burnett was my favorite, and I could do impressions of Carol Burnett all day long. I looked at Carol Burnett and her ability to entertain people and be funny, and also be smart and classy. That feeling I got when I looked at what she does, that made me go, "Oh, that's what I want to do one day."

Public speaking gave me the same thrill, and later on, I found that same thrill in video marketing, going live on Facebook. The first online course that I created was called the Facebook Live Superstore. It was an online course that taught social media mavens, anyone who wanted to use social media how to use Facebook Live, and I remember ... I started my business purely because I wanted to make money without working for a boss. That was my only goal, make money without working for a boss, and I started my business just after Elle was born, and so the actual exact date I kicked it off was the 1st of July, 2014, was my first official day in business.

By Valentine's Day, 2016, it had been an up and down journey of epic proportions, mostly up in terms of learning curve and mostly down in terms of bank account volume, but I remember sitting on the patio at our house in Perth on the 14th of February, which would've been a ridiculously hot, dry summer's day in Perth, and it was Valentine's Day and it was a Sunday, and I had watched several people on Periscope that day. Now, Periscope, for those of you who don't know, was the first live broadcasting social media app for phones. It was owned by Twitter, and for whatever reason, Twitter did a really bad job of using Periscope and supporting Periscope, and they lasted not even a year, and then Facebook launched Facebook Live, and then Periscope was gone. Everybody went to Facebook, but I remember sitting on Valentine's Day there and committing to my husband, who was turning gray much faster than I would like him to because of his wife's entrepreneurial adventures, and saying to him, "This time it's going to work. This time I'm going to figure it out."

I said, "I'm going to go live on Periscope every single day." It's so funny, I think back about my upload speed that I got at Perth that day, and most days I couldn't even get one meg per second upload speed, so actually, it's impossible to build an audience with one meg per second upload speed because it was so wobbly. It's ridiculous. No one can hear what I'm saying because I'm constantly freezing, but I saw my friends in America do it, and I thought, "Well, if they can do it, then I can do it," not remembering that they have much faster internet speed than I had at the time here in 1942 Perth, so I started going live on Periscope and I got the same thrill from standing, like sitting and talking to people for up to an hour every day, but it was such a hustle, that by December 2016 I had quit. I couldn't sustain it. It was too much.

When Facebook Live launched, I jumped over on Facebook Live, and then I launched my online course, sold it twice. You know the story, made $2,000, spent $400 in ads. Those were the days when you could still launch with $400. Made $2,000 and called it a big, fat failure and quit. I was exhausted, and I think had I not been as exhausted, had I not lost so much of my passion and had I not gotten really worn out by the form in which I was trying to reach audiences ... By form, I mean the mode, the method, the container, which was live broadcasting.

Had I not been so exhausted from that, I probably would've sold my course more and continued, but I was broke, I was tired, and I felt absolutely exhausted. You know that little cartoon of the guy who's digging for diamonds, and you only see this sort of cut through of this person under the ground digging, and you can literally see that he's like a millimeter away from the diamond, and then he says, "Oh, forget it. This is too hard," and he quits. If I had known then what I know now, I wouldn't have quit then, but I'd lost my mojo. I'd lost all my energy. I was exhausted, I was overwhelmed, I was tired of trying new things, I needed a break, and so I went back to my day job, but what I learnt between then and now, with having many different versions, experiencing many different versions of the same sort of tiredness, the same sort of burnout, the same sort of exhaustion from form, exhaustion from the method that I'm using to give creative outlet, to have as a creative outlet, that then turns into money, which it can be different things.

For me, it's been social media. There was a time when I loved social media, and there are times when I hate social media. Live video, there've been times where I've loved live video, and there are times when I hate live video. Facebook and Instagram ads, I will tell you, there are times when I love ads so much and there have been times where I felt like I want to stick a fork in my eye if I have to talk about ads again. The challenge of helping clients launch has brought me so much joy, and then it didn't.

I have never loved doing project management and I have never loved doing logistics management, and so whenever there's too much project management or logistics management in my day-to-day life, in my day-to-day business management, it sucks the life out of me. As I've grown, I've gone through so many versions of what I loved about my business and what I didn't love. There are times when a client meeting can be the highlight of my week, and other times where a client meeting can be the most draining part of my week. Same with social media, same with launching, same with coaching. It's all the same, because there's two things that doesn't change.

That's why I'm still here. There are two things that never changes. The one is everywhere I go, there I am. What that means is I take my attitude, my boredom, my desire for new challenges, my need for new and interesting things, and my lack of abundance mindset with me everywhere I go, and so wherever I am, there I am. That hasn't changed.

That will always be the same, so I know that it's not my outer environment that has to change, it's my inner environment that has to change. The second thing that has never changed is my love of the game. I guess if you've done this for as long as I have and you've had as many ups and downs and you're still doing it, you got to know you have the love of the game. You got to know that you're a born entrepreneur. The creativity, the teaching, seeing the progress in my students, watching their faces as the penny finally drops, hearing the best questions being asked, and then realizing that what I made up in my head actually makes sense to someone else, and because of me making up some crazy metaphor or some model that they can use to understand how things work, suddenly it clicks into place for them.

Hiring smart women and seeing what they're capable of, and seeing what they bring to the table, that never gets old. Never. That's the love of the game. The two things that never changes is number one, everywhere I am, there I am. Everywhere I go, there I am, so I have to know that this is an inner game. The second thing that never changes is the love of the game.

It's the fun. It's the joy is in the journey. Those two things are a constant, and so I have a few tactical things you can try, that if you find yourself in a place where you've lost your mojo, you are not quite as passionate as you used to be, things that you used to love is now annoying you in your business, or you find yourself just either bored or constantly searching out new ways to do things, and thereby sabotaging yourself because you never do the same thing long enough, then I have a few practical things you can do, questions you can ask yourself, reflections you can ponder to see if there's a way you can change it. In December, my family and I went on a family holiday to Green Island. Green Island is an island in the middle of the Great Barrier Reef, and it's actually not an island, it's a sand cay, which is something I had to learn, what that is.

It's just basically a pile of sand in the ocean that is sticking out above the ocean, and then plants grew on the sand, and now it's an island. That's pretty much what a sand cay is, so it's just a sand bank in the middle of the ocean that has so much plants growing on it that now, it's habitable, inhabitable. Is that the word? Beautiful, because it's one of the only places where you can literally walk into the ocean and see the coral and swim in the coral, and because there hadn't been tourists in two years, it was just magnificent. Green Island, look it up.

It's beautiful. While I was on holiday in Green Island, Rebecca, who I had hired a few months before to manage our client relationships, so she works with our most senior high-level CEO members of The Launch Lounge, reached out to me and said she needs my help with some of the client work. I said, "Okay. Let me grab some piña coladas and let me grab my computer and get comfy by the pool, and then you and I can go over this." Now, of course, when I'm on holiday, it's not ideal for me to go to work, but Rebecca was new and I knew I should do my best to help her do the best work while I'm away.

If that means giving her a couple of hours, or at least at that stage, I thought it was going to be like half an hour of my time so that she can run things while I'm away, that's a small sacrifice to make. I sat down with Rebecca and we started going over a client funnel, and two and a half hours later, two piña coladas later, I was still talking to her, and when I put my computer down, my husband kind of looked at me. Emil looked at me and he said, "What was that about? Why are you working for two and a half hours?," and I said to him, "You know what? That was so energizing."

"I enjoyed that so much." I realized that I had lost the passion for doing that, for unpacking client funnels because I was so tired by the end of the year, but after a few days on holiday and with knowing that there's nowhere else to be, there's no rush, I can just sit down and teach Rebecca this and go over this with her in detail, I realized how much I love it. It was such a full circle moment for me because I was so hungry for a holiday, tired and ready to take a break, and not wanting to do that sort of thing while I'm on holiday, but then after a few days of rest, after a few days of recovery, jumping back in and being allowed to be there and really explore it in depth with Rebecca helped me remember how much I love it. The first thing I want to share with you that I'd love you to do if your business is wearing you out is identify what's really going on. Is it that you just need a break? Are you tired?

Do you need a holiday? Is it that you've been chasing the wrong thing just because it seemed like it is the next thing? That often happens. I chased the wrong thing because I thought it's the next best thing for a while. For a long time, I kept chasing better quality clients inside the agency better. I kept increasing the prices, thinking that that's going to bring me a better quality client.

I kept thinking if we can just make the systems and processes better, and what I know today is I was chasing the wrong thing because if someone comes in cold, and suddenly they have to have this almost marriage-like relationship with me, that's literally like grabbing someone off the street and marrying them. That is never going to be a set up for a healthy boundaries and for respect, so have you been chasing the wrong thing just because it seemed like it's the next thing, or maybe have you held on too long to the idea that your business has to take on a specific form? Maybe you look at your competition, and they have a specific form, and so therefore, you think that should be your form. Maybe you look at an industry leader and they have a specific form, and so you think that should be your form by form, I mean whatever vehicle you use inside your business to conduct business, so maybe it's webinars. You've learnt how to do webinars, but really, you hate webinars.

You could change it. Just because everyone else is doing it, you don't have to do it, or maybe it's a challenge or a workshop, or maybe everyone else does free lead magnets and you want to do a paid lead magnet. Whatever that is, just evaluate the form. See if you've got the right form. Finally, I want to ask you, "Do you just need new energy or do you need new systems, or do you need to start over again completely?"

Like maybe you just need to stop, take a sabbatical, and start again. My personal mission for a while, I want to say I developed this personal mission after I started making money in the business. It's kind of like Maslow's hierarchy of needs. Once your survival needs are taken care of, you start focusing more on your self-actualization needs, and we all start a business because we want to make a difference in people's lives, but first of all, we start a business because we need to make money. We want to make money.

We use money to survive. We use money to thrive in a physical world that runs on capitalism. We need money. We want money. We make money. We are here to make money, but once we make enough money to meet our survival needs, and I have heard it quoted that once you make more than $75,000 a year, money doesn't make you any happier.

Like you're kind of reset back to your original preset of happiness once your needs are taken care of. Now, that study was done maybe 10 years ago, so I'm going to say that has probably been increased right now to like 175,000 a year, but whatever that number is for you, just remember that there's a number where it moves from being about the money to being about the personal mission. Now, my personal mission has been for a while to redesign how women work and earn money in the world. That hasn't changed. There were slight nuances that have changed.

At one point, I realized that when women work differently, men benefit as well, and so I said, "Well, shouldn't men then work differently as well?," and yes, they should, but that's not my mission. My mission is to redesign how women work and earn money in the world. The model may change. The way I do this may change. The container might change.

What I do on a day-to-day basis can change, but the mission stays the same, so if you find yourself feeling a little bit demotivated in your business, try to redefine your purpose and remember your passions. Ask yourself if your business aligns with your current purpose. Have you actually done the exercise to figure out what your larger personal mission is, what the larger thing is that gets you up in the morning and brings you to work? Is it still your passion, because maybe your passion is ... My passion is to stand up in front of people and speak, and see their faces light up, but that's not my mission.

That's a vehicle that lights me up that I use to achieve my mission, so maybe you need to differentiate between your passion and your purpose, because ultimately, if you can combine your passion and your purpose in your business, wow. Passion plus purpose equal profits. Hmm, I should trademark that. Are you still passionate about the form your business has taken on, and if you're not, then take on another form. Stay true to your passion, stay true to your purpose, but know that the form your business takes on can change. Doesn't have to stay the same.

You have permission to do something else. I love the saying, "Everywhere you go, there you are." I just feel like it is so appropriate in so many different situations, and I always say it to myself, "Everywhere you go, there you are" to remind me that I have to stay present to the present moment. Nothing is ever going to be better than this moment. There's this story that I heard an Indian guru, I'll call him a guru, a spiritual leader, Indian spiritual leader, talk about, and he was saying that, "When you ascend the mountain and you keep coming back to the same town, at some point, you have to realize you're walking in circles." If you're coming back to the same disappointment, if you're coming back to the same frustration, if you're coming back to the same belief that once you get to your next goal, you'll be happy.

Once you get to your next goal, you'll have enough money. Once your audience reaches its next level, once your ads finally come together, once you have copywriting skills, whatever the thing is you're telling yourself that is lacking from this moment, that if you can only figure out how to fill that void, ah, everywhere you go, there you are, you're going to get to the top of the mountain only to realize you've been going in circles, and you're right back at the foot of another mountain, so just take a moment and stop and appreciate what you have. Appreciate what you've built. Appreciate how far you've come, and ask yourself, "If money was never an issue, never ever, ever, what would you be doing instead, and how can you do more of that in your business right now?" One of my favorite feelings in the world, my most favorite feeling in the world was, even as I was growing up, that moment when I can be Carol Burnett, and everybody laughs at me, and I can perform and they can laugh at me, or standing on stage, either performing, acting, singing, dancing, delivering some kind of communication and watching people's faces, what you're feeling.

You can feel the energy. When you're on stage, in front of an audience, you're completely blind to the audience, because those lights that shine on the stage are so bright, you don't see the people, but you can feel the energy in that room with ... I don't know. We must have six senses that we can feel it. It's in how they breathe and it's in how they sound, how quiet they are or how responsive they are. You can literally have a two-way conversation with thousands of people that you cannot see when you're on a stage.

I love that feeling. I love that feeling. The other day, I was unpacking a webinar for one of my clients. They'd asked me to look at their webinar and give them feedback, and for 90 minutes straight, I went from slide to slide to slide, unpacking their webinar for them and repacking it, putting it back together, and seeing their faces and watching their eyes light up gave me the exact same feeling I used to have standing on stage. Afterwards, Rebecca emailed me and she said, "Holy cow, you have no idea how you are in your element when you do that," and I said to her, "You have no idea how good it feels to do that," and I realized that there are ways to tap into your passions.

When I quit doing musical theater, I thought I have to give up that feeling forever, and I'm so glad I have built a business that gives me that feeling again, so I wonder, "What is one thing you can do today to move closer to a form in your business that will energize and excite you the same way teaching, coaching, sharing with clients, speaking to clients, speaking to students, speaking to you energizes me?" Lastly, the last little question I have for you is, "What do you need to completely give up and let die to bring this new thing to life?" Maybe there's a reason you've lost your mojo. Maybe this thing is done. Maybe you're holding onto it because you believe there isn't another way or because you have to give up something. Elle, my eight-year-old drinks gallons of milk.

I mean, that kid goes through two and a half liters of milk every other day. She drinks so much milk that her poo turns white. Yeah. I know, oversharing, but seriously, if my kid stopped drinking milk, it's like changing, like cannot be healthy, and she's also allergic to it, and she will not stop drinking it, so she will commit. She'll get tummy aches, and then I'll tell her, "You got to stop drinking milk," and she says, "Okay, mommy, I'm going to stop."

Then, 24 hours later, she's in tears and she's like, "Give me my milk. I need my milk." Her milk is literally holding her back, so I wonder, "What's your milk?" I used to believe that my accent will hold me back. I gave that up.

I used to believe that I had to prove how smart I am. I gave that up. I used to believe that I have to show my students that I know all the answers. Man, it feels good to give that one up. I gave that one up.

I do not need to have the answers. I used to believe that everyone should have an online courses business. I wanted the whole world, everyone near me has to have an online courses business. It's the bee's knees. It's for everyone.

Everyone needs it. I had to let go of that. It wasn't serving me. Not everyone should have an online business. I gave that up.

I used to believe that I'm limited because I live in Australia, because the market is in the U.S.. I used to believe that I'm limited because I'm known just for Facebook ads. I had to give that up. I used to believe I'm limited because I can't spell or do maths. I had to give that up, and I used to believe that I'm limited because I have ADD and I'm a bit all over the shop. I had to give that up.

What is causing you a tummy ache that you need to give up in order to thrive? What do you need to completely give up and let die to bring this new thing, this new passion and purpose to life? When I stopped doing musical theater, I thought that passion is completely going to die and I'll never be able to replace it. What I know now is that the passion follows me, and I get to tap into it and what it gives me at any moment in time as long as I remember that it is my passion that fuels my creativity, not the form in which my creativity is expressed. Form changes.

Joy and passion stays the same, so find the joy, follow the passion, and know that the form is always fluid. You get to make it up, and everywhere you go, there you are. That's it for this week. That's all I've got for you. I think that's a mouthful.

Send me a DM on Instagram or an email, salome@shineandsucceed. If any of what I've said today hit a nerve for you, or if anything I've said really makes you go, "Yes, this is exactly what I needed to hear," I want to hear from you. Thank you so much for listening. Have a wonderful week. If you love this episode and you're a committed online course launcher who wants to learn how to grow your profits in your next course launch, and you want to know how to successfully scale your online courses business to seven figures and beyond, then I'd love to see you inside The Launch Lounge.

The Launch Lounge is the only community online that is dedicated solely to helping you develop every aspect of your online courses business so that you can build your business to scale. With no one size fits all solutions, just the right education you need when you need it, coaching from our team of experts in different areas of launching and scaling, and the best community on the internet, the Launch Lounge is your online course building home if you want profitable launches that scale your business to seven figures and beyond. To get on the wait list for our next enrollment season, go to shineandsucceed.com/launch. Thank you so much for listening. If you had fun, please come back next week and remember to hit that subscribe button so you never miss a thing.

161. IOS Updates. Tools To Improve Performance

161. iOS Updates. Tools To Improve Performance

21 June 2022 | By Salome Schillack

listen now:

This week we're tackling the golden question.. should you be using Facebook's new tech tool CAPI (AKA Conversation API) right now?

If you're anything like me, tech isn't your favorite cup of tea. It can be really intimidating trying to figure it all out, and it always feels like as soon as you’re on top of it all, Facebook surprises us all with new updates to decode. (Thaaaannnkkss #not).

But no need to decode alone. We’ll unpack everything you need to know in this week's episode of The Shine Show!

We've heard that Zucks has been sliding into your inboxes lately with some important updates on CAPI.

First things first…. don't panic!

Secondly…. What the heck is CAPI?

CAPI is causing quite the stir in the online marketing world right now. And so it should!

Beyond the slightly uncomfortable change in tech levers & systems, CAPI is excellent news for all online course creators. In a nutshell, it's a game-changing tool that will improve your ads' overall performance and decrease the cost you pay per campaign.

Love that for us!

So how exactly can you use CAPI and start amping up those ad results?

I'm lucky enough to have three of the smartest cyber cookies I know working on my team. Not only are they geniuses in tech, but they can also explain it in a way that doesn't sound like morse code!

This week on the show, Caroline, Amy & Hana take a deep dive into CAPI and give us the full rundown of the new updates, its impact on iOS updates, and how you can start benefiting from it today.

Grab a coffee (or something a little stronger if you need, no judgment here), set aside 17 minutes, and let's get techy!

Xxx

Salome

PS: If you’re a committed online course launcher who wants to scale bigger and make more sales, The Launch Lounge is the place to be. Inside the membership, you’ll be first in the know with all the new tech updates, have access to all the education you need and access to industry experts who will personally coach you to 6-figure launches and beyond! Get on the waitlist here.

Subscribe and Review in iTunes Please!

When you subscribe and review the podcast not only does that give me the warm and fuzzies all over, it also helps other people to find the show.

When other people find the show they get to learn how to create more freedom in their lives from their online courses too!!

So do a good deed for all womenkind and subscribe and review this show and I will reward you with a shout out on the show!!

Links I mentioned in this episode:

Scroll down for a full transcript of this episode

more episodes

175. We’re Taking A Break. Here’s Why And How You Can Do It Too

174. Some Thoughts On Making Lots Of Money

173. 3 Reasons NOW Is The Best Time To Start A Digital Courses Business with Amy Porterfield

172. 25 Biggest Lessons In Online Marketing I Learned From Amy Porterfield

171. Social Media: One Thing That Makes All The Effort Worthwhile

170. How to Choose the Right Name for Your Online Course

169. Content Planning For Posts VS Content For Your Course And Launches

168. Managing Your Money As A Small Business Owner with Darcie Milfeld

167. 3 Lies You Were Told About Hiring An Ads Manager

166. How To Create Your Online Course Faster with Gina Onativia

165. The Only Way Low Dollar Offers Are Working Today

164. New Ad Targeting Options That Are Working Now

TRANSCRIPT

Salome Schillack (00:00):

Hello, and welcome to episode number 161 of the Shine Show. In today's episode, we are going to talk about some iOS updates. And specifically we're going to share with you tools that will help you improve the performance of your ads. Now, you know that I have been running ads for online course creators from way back in 2016. And as the agency that I've built have grown, I have added more and more incredibly smart women to my team. These women really know so much about Facebook and Instagram ads that they can put me to shame. And I am so happy that I can hand off all these techy things to them. And they understand it so well that they can implement it for our clients and help our VIP students inside the launch lounge, really understand how these things works.

Salome Schillack (01:03):

But what I wanted to do was I wanted to bring them on the show and I wanted them to share with you in their natural native language, which is geek speak, what these tools are, and how they work, and how you can use them, and what you should be doing. So without further ado, let me bring you Caroline Fenton, Amy Wyhoon, and Hana Abello. Three of this smartest Facebook and Instagram ads managers that I know, who spend all their days running ads for online course creators like you, as they discuss iOS updates and tools that will improve your performance.

Salome Schillack (01:51):

Giving up your time and freedom to make money is so 2009. Hi, I'm your host Salome Schillack. And I help online course creators launch, grow, and scale their businesses with Facebook and Instagram ads. So that they can make more money and have an even bigger impact in the world. If you are ready to be inspired to dream bigger, launch sooner, and grow your online business faster, then tune in. Because you are ready to shine. And this is the Shine Show.

Salome Schillack (02:25):

I wonder if you got the email Facebook has been sending out to anyone who runs ads for their business in the last six months. Not just one email, many emails they've sent out, telling everyone about Conversion API or this brand new tool that they have developed to help you improve tracking. They really have caused quite a stir amongst our clients and our students with these emails, they keep sending out telling everyone that they have this tool that everyone should be implementing. And everyone should be getting it because it's going to work better for you for data and analytics. But then when you try to figure out how to actually implement this tool, Facebook is like, "We don't really know." And they don't really have clear instructions either. Most of the time their canned answer is, "Here's a link to a blog post where you can read more about it and send it to your developer and have them figure it out."

Salome Schillack (03:28):

This tool that Facebook is talking about is called Conversion API, or abbreviated as CAPI. And if you have had a conversation with the Facebook Ads Marketing Specialist, and they've told you need CAPI. Or you've seen those emails come out from Facebook or Meta telling you need CAPI. Then we are going to unpack that for you today. And we're going to talk about what CAPI is and how exactly it helps us get more accurate data for our Facebook and Instagram ads. We uncover a little bit more about the relationship between CAPI and the Pixel and whether or not CAPI is going to replace the Pixel. And we answer the question, should you be using CAPI right now? So here to unpack all of that for you is Caroline Fenton, Amy Wyhoon, and Hana Abello. Like I said, three of the smartest women I know. Three women I can geek out with all day long and they are going to explain CAPI to you.

Caroline Fenton (04:32):

All right. So one of the things we get asked a lot about is Conversion API or CAPI, for short. So you might have heard this thing talked about in the world of Facebook ads, and we just wanted to have a little chat today about what it is, and a few things around it. And hopefully at the end of the conversation, you guys will have a bigger understanding as to what it is and why you need to worry about it. So, yeah. What is Conversion API?

Amy Wyhoon (04:56):

Ooh, I've got this one, Caroline. Conversion API allows advertisers to send web events from their service directly to Facebook. It creates a connection between the data and Facebook. So the Pixel previously. Like we put the Pixel on the website and Facebook would be able to read what was happening off, like Facebook on your website. And now the Conversion API, the piece of code that we connect now sends traffic direct from the server. So it's like sending it the other way back to Facebook.

Caroline Fenton (05:34):

Right. Okay. So just to clarify, I guess. We've got the current Pixel, which is using browser and then next the Conversion API, which is, what would you say rather than browser, it's server. Server.

Amy Wyhoon (05:49):

Server side. Yeah.

Caroline Fenton (05:50):

Okay. So how would you sum it up if you say how they differ?

Amy Wyhoon (05:54):

So the Conversion API gives Facebook a more complete picture, especially with obviously the tracking issue that iOS has caused us. It's just giving us a bigger picture as to what is actually happening off Facebook. So that we can still manage the ads in the back end and know what's happening. It helps improve our reporting so we can keep on top of our clients ads as well.

Caroline Fenton (06:23):

All right. So in of why we need it, you say, "Yeah, it gives us a bit bigger picture of user activity. It's going to help improve reporting and conversion tracking. It gives us more complete picture of what's going on and ads for maybe a bit more data that might been lost to browser.

Amy Wyhoon (06:40):

Absolutely. And it helps us to, obviously, optimize our campaigns too. Because Facebook's got more data in the campaign to learn from. It's essentially the same data as the Pixel. But it just adds a little bit more info to it and assigns it an activity. Like it gives it an event ID so that you can track it a little bit within the back. Of course another question that's thrown around is the CAPI going to replace the Pixel?

Caroline Fenton (07:17):

Yeah, that is a good question. I guess the short answer is, no. In the short term, at least, the browser Pixel, as we know it isn't going anywhere. So no, it doesn't replace it. It actually supplements it. Like we were saying earlier, it's giving you a more complete set of data to work with. So they actually work together and together they send Facebook as much data as possible to be able to optimize your ad campaigns even better. So basically both will fire from browser and from the server for the CAPI and then Facebook matches that data and then reports them back as the same event. So it's a process obviously to get that working. And you might have heard about the de-duplication issue that some people have and the process of de-duplicating events. Did you want to talk bit more about de-duplication?

Hana Abello (08:06):

Yeah. So de-duplication means that two events have been merged into one. So earlier you mentioned that the CAPI won't be replacing the pixel. And Facebook actually recommends having the CAPI on top of the Pixel. So if we have both the Pixel on the website and the CAPI on the backend reporting data back to Facebook. If someone does something on your website, Facebook is getting the same information from two different sources and the way that Facebook can tell that it's the same activity, even though it's coming in as two events is through the event ID that it assigns to this event.

Caroline Fenton (08:55):

Thanks Hana. Yeah. I think it's really important to talk about de-duplication because a lot of people they might have installed the CAPI. They might see it working. But there's this de-duplication error and things going on. So I don't think it's foolproof at the moment, is it? In terms of-

Hana Abello (09:11):

Yeah, no. So a lot of the native integrations that websites and platforms have with Facebook, in terms of implementing CAPI on those platforms, it hasn't really perfected de-duplication yet. So we'll have to just wait and see how they improve and develop their tracking, so that we can implement CAPI better. At the moment, I won't recommend jumping into it right now. Especially with the issue of de-duplication. Because the problem is it will over report the number of activities on ads manager. So even if you're only getting one opt-in, if de-duplication is not foolproof, then that means you'll be seeing two leads or two opt-ins on your CAPI.

Caroline Fenton (10:07):

Yeah. 100 percent. I think it's really important that's flagged as well. 'Cause as much as it might be easy to set up or easy enough to integrate CAPI, it's the de-duplication that really becomes the issue. And I guess another element of this is, this CAPI really got brought around at the time of iOS, when iOS 14 came into play, there was a lot of conversation around Conversion API. And I'm not sure how much confusion there is around CAPI replacing that data or basically solving the problems of iOS 14. But do you want to just talk a bit more about what's happened since iOS 14 and why it, maybe, is more important since then?

Hana Abello (10:51):

Yeah. So we know that the Pixel is getting less reliable. And with iOS 14, with the update, it meant that Facebook lost visibility on the activity of iOS users who have opted out of tracking. And so CAPI really helps send back more data and that just improves the optimization of the algorithm and the tracking side of it. So even though Conversion API, isn't an actual solution to the problems that iOS 14 gave us and more of justifying the additional feature, anything we can do to send can help with our campaign.

Caroline Fenton (11:40):

Yeah. That's great. I guess it's important to talk about the data and the data is still lost. It's not like CAPI actually solves this for us or does it? Does it solve the lost data?

Hana Abello (11:54):

I don't believe it does. So the API still has to follow the same rules as the Pixel. If someone has opted out of iOS tracking, then the API won't be able to report any data on that. Because they've completely opted out of it.

Caroline Fenton (12:15):

Yeah. Like it has no more visibility. It doesn't. Yeah. They can't see anything else that browser Pixel can't see. Apart from maybe when you're talking about cookie or ad blockers, has it got some benefit, in that case, if someone has an ad blocker turned on?

Hana Abello (12:30):

Yeah, for sure. I think that's where server side tracking or CAPI really helps is being able to track the data that is lost when someone has ad blockers on. Which is a lot of the browsers nowadays have add blockers on by default, right?

Caroline Fenton (12:50):

Yeah. Yeah, definitely do. I think it's really that privacy first world, isn't it? That we're heading in. It's trying to future proof everything. So it's just setting these things up now to future proof yourself against what might happen. And you may have heard chatting in the browser Pixel is disappearing. I don't think that's true. I think it's here to say for a little bit. But if it does, then CAPI is going to be what takes over.

Caroline Fenton (13:17):

So hopefully that was pretty helpful. We've covered what it is, how it differs from the current browser Pixel, and why you need it. We talked about if it replaces the Pixel, as we know it. And de-duplication of those events as they come in a little bit around how it's important since iOS 14. And just really it's a decision to make as to whether you try to go ahead and install it or not. And as Hana mentioned, it's not really necessarily that simple. Well, simple enough to install and set up. It's the de-duplication that can be an issue. Anything else to add ladies? All right. Thanks. Good to chat to you all.

Hana Abello (13:56):

Thanks.

Salome Schillack (14:00):

Well, I don't know if your brain is hurting, but my brain hurts a little bit after all that. I guess what I want you to take away from this episode is that whenever Facebook contacts you about Conversion API, at least you have some reference point or a podcast episode where you can go, "Hang on. What is that again?" And you can come back to it, reference it, listen to it again, try to understand exactly what Facebook is trying to achieve with Conversion API. And if you want to speak to your developer about CAPI to have that integrated into your account, put on your account, activated on your account, I guess is the right way to say it. Then by all means, do that do understand also that you do not have to have any fear of missing out. There's no FOMO. There's no scarcity. There's no urgency for you to use CAPI.

Salome Schillack (15:00):

And if you are just using what you've got and it's working for you now, just keep doing that. So then please just ignore the emails. Facebook is sending you to say, you need CAPI. You will need it eventually. But right now it's in very early stages of development and even Facebook themselves, aren't super clear on how to help people integrate CAPI into their accounts. Okay. Well, I hope that was a really useful episode to you.

Salome Schillack (15:29):

I trust that this will appeal to all of my super geeky listeners out there. And if today wasn't exactly your cup of tea, because it's a bit too technical. Let me know because I want to know if we should do more technical Facebook ad stuff or if you prefer other broader marketing things instead. Have a wonderful week and I'll talk to you next week. Bye. If you love this episode and you're a committed online course launcher who wants to learn how to grow your profits in your next course launch, and you want to know how to successfully scale your online courses business to seven figures and beyond. Then I'd love to see you inside the Launch Lounge.

Salome Schillack (16:12):

The Launch Lounge is the only community online that is dedicated solely to helping you develop every aspect of your online courses business. So you can build a business that scales. There's no one size fits all solutions here, just the right education you need when you need it. Coaching from our team of experts in different areas of launching and scaling and the best community on the internet. The Launch Lounge is your online course, building home. If you want profitable launches that scale your business to seven figures and beyond. To get on the wait list for our next enrollment season, go to shineandsucceed.com/launch. Thank you so much for listening. If you had fun, please come back next week and remember to hit that subscribe button. So you never miss the thing.

160. Navigating Fear and Reclaiming Personal Power With Claire Yee

14 June 2022 | By Salome Schillack

listen now:

This week’s episode is like a day spa for your brain!

You're busy working on your business, course, students, and family, but when was the last time you worked on yourself?

If it's been a hot minute, then today's episode of The Shine Show is especially for you.

Your potential for success, for more students, and more income comes down to one thing: showing up as your best self.

Want to know the secret to turning up as your best self and having an endless supply of magnetic energy that your community can't get enough of?

Mindset!

If you have been putting yourself last for way too long and neglecting the very brain that thought up all those brilliant ideas of yours…

Stop what you're doing because, without some proper TLC, that same brilliant mind of yours also has the power to rip it all away.

If you are constantly pulled in a million directions, unsure where to go next, having surges of 'pick me' energy, and feeling like you're always chasing students desperate for them to join you…..guess what!

We've got some mindset work to do.

And I've got the perfect gal for you to meet.

This week on the show, I'm joined by mindset coach Claire Yee who has helped thousands of women develop life-altering mindsets that help them achieve their dreams.

Being around Claire is the equivalent of taking your brain to a day spa. So put on your fluffy robe, get out the cucumber slices and prepare yourself for some mind nourishment that will set you up for a relaxed, calm, and collected week!

This episode will impact and change you for the better, so grab a cuppa and learn how to get back to being your best self!

XXX

Salome

PS: If you loved hearing from Claire and could do with more brain day spas on the weekly, join us in The Launch Lounge, where a whole community of experts will be cheering you on, step-by-step, as you grow your online course. Join the waitlist here.

Subscribe and Review in iTunes Please!

When you subscribe and review the podcast not only does that give me the warm and fuzzies all over, it also helps other people to find the show.

When other people find the show they get to learn how to create more freedom in their lives from their online courses too!!

So do a good deed for all womenkind and subscribe and review this show and I will reward you with a shout out on the show!!

Links I mentioned in this episode:

Scroll down for a full transcript of this episode

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TRANSCRIPT

Salome Schillack (00:00):
Hello, and welcome to episode number 160 of The Shine Show. Today's show is called Navigating Fear and Reclaiming Personal Power and I'm interviewing one of my favorite humans on this planet Claire Yee. Claire has been a student of mine for well over two years, and it has been such an honor and a delight every time I see her show up on one of those live Q&A calls, whether it was back in the day when she was an A-lister or now inside the Launch Lounge.

Salome Schillack (00:38):
Claire has built more than one successful business. But the thing that I love most about Claire is her beautiful, warm, welcoming smile, the incredibly beautiful way that she just speaks to every single person in the community and her wisdom, her knowledge. She really is like the mother to all of us inside the Launch Lounge and it's no wonder that she is our resident mindset coach.

Salome Schillack (01:14):
I want to share Claire's magic with you all and just to serve as a little bit of an intro, I'm going to read you her bio, but just know that these words are not enough to sum up who Claire Yee is. Claire's a mindset coach who has taught thousands of expecting parents over the past decade to bring their babies into the world with love, confidence, and empowerment. She loves supporting women to discover the strength and magnificence of who they truly are so that their life becomes a reflection of their heart's desire. Everything about that just gels so well with my vision and mission in life and so it is my honor and my privilege to introduce to you a tiny little bit of Claire magic, and I know you're going to love Claire just as much as I do as we talk about ways that you can navigate fear and reclaim your personal power in this journey of building your online courses business.

Salome Schillack (02:23):
Giving up your time and freedom to make money is so 2009. Hi, I'm your host Salome Schillack and I help online course creators launch, grow and scale their businesses with Facebook and Instagram ads so that they can make more money and have an even bigger impact in the world. If you are ready to be inspired to dream bigger launch sooner and grow your online business faster, then tune in because you are ready to shine and this is The Shine Show.

Salome Schillack (02:57):
Claire, thank you so much for being here with me today and thank you for being the mindset mother of all mothers, mother of dragons, mother of mindset for all of our beautiful Launch Lounge students. I'm so lucky to have you in my community and on the show today.

Claire Yee (03:17):
Oh, thank you so much for having me. I'm just so excited and so overjoyed to be here. Can't wait to do this.

Salome Schillack (03:26):
So anyone listening to the show today who is perhaps feeling frustrated, feeling scared, feeling confused, feeling like they're being pulled in thousands of different directions, I'm trying to think about how all the feelings I had when I had to learn to trust my intuition and follow my heart in business. Anyone who feels any of those feelings is going to get so much value out of today because we're going to talk about really how to hear the voice inside, right, and tap into it. So before we dive into that, just tell everyone a little bit, who's new to you. Just tell everyone a little bit who you are, what your story is and how did you come to be the mindset coach for online course creators.

Claire Yee (04:16):
Thank you. So I always think, where do I start? Who am I?

Salome Schillack (04:24):
You have reinvented yourself so many times.

Claire Yee (04:27):
I know it's always ... Okay. Let's start there then. So all at the same time, it was the year 2008. I did my life coaching training. I became a mother and I started my spiritual journey. They all triggered each other off well maybe not so much becoming a mother, but it wasn't planned ahead.

Salome Schillack (04:47):
That's just triggering.

Claire Yee (04:54):
Yeah but working, going on all of those journeys all at the same time, stretched me in so many beautiful and challenging ways and building a business, being an entrepreneur and then also being a mother and having all of the experiences of a mother and how to look after this child and bring them up in a way that they're going to be their best selves in the world. That's always been my main goal as a mother is to always just be bringing them up as their best selves and to do that, I've had to work on how can I be my best self?

Claire Yee (05:44):
I'm not that when I'm not giving to myself when I'm tired and frustrated and stressed. I can't show up in my business and really connect with people properly and share my wisdom and help support others to transform when I'm also not being my best self. And so, that's where the spiritual journey has really supported me throughout all the threads of each area to discover who I am, what is my true voice. Every day, it's an unfolding and a reinvention and I'm discovering more and more about myself each and every day. I love supporting others to do the same.

Salome Schillack (06:32):
So good at it. You are so good at it.

Claire Yee (06:35):
Thank you.

Salome Schillack (06:37):
You have been on this whole online course journey with your own courses and you successfully sold online courses. So how did you pivot from online courses to mindset coaching?

Claire Yee (06:49):
I think, well, mindset coaching has always been a thread in what I've shared and what I've done particularly through the life coaching aspect of it. But, as entrepreneurs, we are the center of our business. We are always there. We've got a choice whether we do it from a space of really shining and showing up as our true selves or really struggling through it and focusing on what's not going right and what's not working. There's always different perspectives and we can be empowered in our choice in that. I think it's always been an integral part of everything that I've done. I don't know that there was a switching point.

Salome Schillack (07:42):
No, I hear you and that's very true. You did HypnoBirthing so I suppose there is always, it's not just in the journey that you discovered and uncovered and leaned into all the spiritual and the mindset things, but it's also in what you were doing that path that you were helping women go on.

Claire Yee (08:04):
Yes. To overcome fear, to listen to their own intuition, to their own voice, to be empowered in their decisions. It's so funny how many parallels there are between birthing and building a business.

Salome Schillack (08:17):
Oh, yes.

Claire Yee (08:20):
It's really fascinating.

Salome Schillack (08:22):
That is very true. That is very true. That horrible first three trimesters where you don't have anything to show for it but you sure feel uncomfortable. Ah! That is true.

Claire Yee (08:40):
And it's a big learning curve. Yeah, there's so many parallels.

Salome Schillack (08:44):
Yeah, when we're building online course businesses, I think anyone who is automatically attracted to building a business or somebody who is a creator by nature and I want to say, I think there's very few people who are not creators by nature. I think there's very few people who truly don't want to create or don't feel they're creative. But for us uber creatives who must start a business, who must give our gifts to other people, who must teach what we've learned and then we discover this magic of online courses, but we also come into it with this paradigm of what we learned in school, what our parents passed on to us, our definition of success, our definition of what's the right way to live, what's other people, how do we learn to just breathe and even begin to know where our intuition lies and how to trust it? How to trust it I think is a whole another thing, but how do we even begin to tap into it?

Claire Yee (10:06):
Oh, I love that question. So it's really a practice and life's experiences allow us the opportunity to practice. And so, really the first step, I suppose is awareness, becoming aware of how am I operating right now, feeling into what is that feeling and if it's a feeling that feels constrictive, intense, and you're going in the downward spiral, or you're just spinning, usually it's coming from a place of stress, but it's usually also coming from a place that's the way we've been taught to be whether that was from school or our conditioning growing up, whatever it's past referenced often when it's tense. Not always, we've great past experiences too, but it's referencing who we were previously when we feel really fixed and stuck and frustrated, and can't hear our intuition, monkey mind keeps going around and around. Yeah, it's that practice in that moment of that awareness, how am I feeling? If it's feeling that it's just accepting. Okay. It is what it is not judging it, because that just stuck in it.

Claire Yee (11:27):
Acceptance is the antidote of judgment and taking that breath, giving yourself that love, that compassion in that moment. What do I need right now? Maybe it's yeah, the deep breathing, going outside and just soaking in the fresh air, moving your body, dancing, doing something that really just shifts you out of, or just having a different conversation with yourself in your mind. There's so many ways that we can shift ourselves into a different state back into our beautiful, abundant creative state and that's where we are operating from our true self.

Claire Yee (12:04):
Our true self is our creative space and the more we play with that, it's a duality of the past way that we used to operate and the way that we can still show up. Then there's really that essence that flows through us that fuels our creativity, and as far as hearing it as our intuition, it's often got a real ... when our intuition is talking to us and whether you think of it as your higher self or your soul or however you think of that energy that you truly are, it's that who you are born as and who your potential of who you have come here to be, when you feel that voice within, it feels there's a strength to it.

Claire Yee (12:59):
The more you recognize it and just get curious about, does that voice feel constrictive, and tenses spirally, or does it feel free? Our intuition, our true intuition will always speak to us from a place of freedom and joy and abundance and prosperity and connection with others and with the universe and with nature. There's so much depth and beauty in the frequency of the voice of our intuition.

Claire Yee (13:27):
It's not always easy to hear. It takes practice. It's often that little nudge of thought that you have before the spiraling happens. You know, when you say I knew that. I knew that was going to happen. So when you're aware of it and the more we listen to that, the more we can start to cultivate our ability to hear it and to make our decisions based on it and to allow it to flow into everything we create.

Salome Schillack (13:58):
I love it so much. Yeah. It's that moment where you can go, "Yeah. Actually, I knew this. I knew this," and I guess we build up a fitness with that every time we go, "Oh, actually I knew that was the right way to go and I will trust it more." It's not a journey that you can arrive at. Right? It's a journey that just keeps unfolding.

Claire Yee (14:24):
Absolutely. It's an everyday journey. There's never a place that we get to where we're like, "We're there. We've made it," which is beautiful because then we'd be, I reckon quite bored with life once we got there, you know?

Salome Schillack (14:38):
Yeah. Yeah.

Claire Yee (14:40):
But the more we practice deciphering between what we're hearing and then following that intuition. Then you can look back and you can go, "Was I actually listening to my intuition or did I override it with the way I've been taught to think about things? Did I override it with worry or logic or what I thought was right based on how I was going to please everybody else rather than please myself?" There's so much that plays into the way we've been taught to operate, but we can untangle from that. It's just a daily practice. Any opportunity in the daytime when you need to make a decision, get curious and playful about it.

Salome Schillack (15:27):
Yeah, I love that. Yeah. Sorry, go ahead.

Claire Yee (15:29):
Yeah. I was just going to say in our businesses, it's so empowering to have this ability to listen to our intuition and to make those decisions based on our intuition. What are we going to call our program? What needs to be in our program? What doesn't feel right in our program? What kind of people is this for? Who do I want to bring onto my team? All these decisions that we make in our business, it's such a beautiful spiritual journey if we let it be.

Salome Schillack (15:56):
Yeah and on that journey then, Claire, I feel like that journey develops and evolves and as it develops and evolves, we become more self-sufficient. That's not the right word. I want to say, "We develop the ability to find our comfort in ourselves and not find our comfort and our validation in ourselves and to not need validation externally from either clients, students, mentors, the internet, social media," and we build up stronger boundaries for who we let into our worlds and how we let them into our worlds and that applies into our pricing and it applies into our customer service and it applies into our refund policies and it applies into how we build community and what the values are in those community. It's ironic that the stronger your boundaries then get, the more your business grows.

Claire Yee (17:09):
Yes, and I think what's beautiful about that it's the stronger you get in yourself and who you are and who you are being it's almost like the vibration that you're putting out is so much more enriched when you are following your own intuition, following your own voice, making decisions based on what works for you and creating from that space. You become so magnetic and your offerings become magnetic because people feel the true you and it's like, "I want some of that." When we stand in our empowerment and who we really are it's irresistible.

Salome Schillack (17:55):
Yeah. Yeah. It is. Like anything, when you are starting a new thing and you're learning a new skill, if you're just starting your business and you're still learning all these skills, it's not going to show up in some radical way for you because you're learning the skill. I think the key is it shows up the more action you take, the sooner it shows up. Right?

Claire Yee (18:23):
Yeah. Yeah and it doesn't all show up at once like you're saying. It's in the somebody connects you with this person or you hear that on a podcast and you hear it louder than something else and it goes, "Oh yes, it's that." And so, it's following those bread crumbs and listening to that intuitive voice that draws you towards those things that feel right. Yeah, it can be such a beautiful path in that way.

Salome Schillack (18:55):
There's something that I want to just explore a little bit. Sometimes that means burning down the house. There's the need to distinguish between our fire and our passion and our creativity and our drive and then we build a business from that. Sometimes those businesses can have run their course and we find that we've outgrown a part of it or we just don't want to serve this section of our community anymore or we want to go in a very different direction.

Salome Schillack (19:40):
I think often where I see that battle come into play is where people then have to go, "Yeah, but I love the money that comes in from this other thing." For me, I can definitely say I have so many times held onto things because of money and push down my intuition about it. I can look at that and go, "Yeah, that's a lesson I hope I don't learn again." Maybe I will and maybe I won't but sometimes it can be a challenge to lean into the intuition when the intuition is saying, "Move in a different direction than where the money's coming from."

Claire Yee (20:26):
Yes, because there's the mold isn't there that we have fitted previous versions of ourselves into? There's society's mold. There's the mold of what everyone thinks, who they think we are, but also who we used to think we were and who we used to be. But as we grow and discover more about who we are and our passions and what we're really here to share with the world and our voice, things do shift and change and evolve. That's where yeah, following the intuition isn't always the easiest path. It's often the path that is not as well worn.

Salome Schillack (21:10):
Yeah. It's mostly the path that's not well worn.

Claire Yee (21:15):
Yeah, but if you look at the people who have really created beautiful change in the world and in ways that really change the world, transform the way we live, they don't follow the path. They don't fit into the mold.

Salome Schillack (21:31):
Oh, yeah. They just trust the thing that's calling them.

Claire Yee (21:36):
Absolutely.

Salome Schillack (21:37):
Yeah.

Claire Yee (21:38):
That's where we create the blue ocean offerings, because they're an extension of our uniqueness and nobody else can create that for us. That'll create that in the same way that we do.

Salome Schillack (21:53):
I'm so glad you touched on that because that so clearly answers the there's no competition ever. There's no competition ever. There is just no such thing.

Claire Yee (22:07):
Yeah. I mean, I feel like people can feel like there is when they're trying to just go, "Well, that works for that person so I'm going to do that and fit into that kind of a box," which it's what they think is the right way, but it's not authentically who they are.

Salome Schillack (22:24):
Yeah.

Claire Yee (22:27):
Yeah, and-

Salome Schillack (22:27):
No, go ahead.

Claire Yee (22:27):
When running our businesses from our authentic true selves then yeah, there's no other person like us and there will be the right people that will be drawn to us because of that.

Salome Schillack (22:40):
It will be the right people and I think it's easy to forget that when you're just starting out and you just want anyone. You want anyone to come and work with you, anyone buy my online course or when you get to six figures and you go, "Wow, I've hustled hard for these six figures and I really don't like what I've built," or you get seven figures and you go, "Yeah, this is great and this is not what I signed up for. I want to go and do something else."

Salome Schillack (23:13):
I love that we can distinguish between this passion and fire that we have inside our hearts. The thing that's our gifts and that we teach and the form in which we teach it. Because we often think the money comes from the form, but the money does not come from the form.

Salome Schillack (23:33):
I can tell everyone this. I have seen ... I literally had two clients who sells exactly the same program in exactly the same niche. One of them ran a launch, made a loss, the other one ran a launch and made half a million dollars and their marketing. Okay. The one's marketing skills is better than the other one, but you cannot tell me that that is not possibility that exists in that same realm for the second client. It's just the possibilities in that realm for both of them.

Claire Yee (24:13):
Absolutely. Yeah. I think it's interesting that people that we attract into our world, they will often feel our alignment and feel who we are almost before we even know it for ourselves.

Salome Schillack (24:29):
Yeah, you're right.

Claire Yee (24:30):
And before we've even are ready to announce it to the world, other people are drawn to us because they can see who we are even if we still feel like we are not quite ready to step out just yet.

Salome Schillack (24:42):
Correct.

Claire Yee (24:43):
Yeah. But that's the magnetism, isn't it?

Salome Schillack (24:46):
Yeah.

Claire Yee (24:46):
It's the magnetism within being at the center of your offering.

Salome Schillack (24:51):
Mm. I love that. I love that. There's value in hearing how your students describe you or hearing how your students say why they're there. Because nine out of 10 times I feel like maybe we buy a course to learn a skill, but we hang around for either a person's warmth or the warmth of the community that they build.

Claire Yee (25:17):
Yeah, and the community they build, it really is an extension of the person that built the community that had that inspiration, followed their own inspiration, their own intuition to build the community in the first place. I look at the Launch Lounge and it's just such a beautiful reflection of you and everything you've created. You've just created the most amazing community and just such a joy to be a part of it.

Salome Schillack (25:45):
Oh, I thank you. I'm like a mama bear over that community and I will say I guess this is a great example. Five years ago I thought my superpower was Facebook ads and then I thought my superpower is marketing and then I thought, "Oh, okay, maybe my superpower is teaching." Today, I know my superpower is identifying potential in very freaking smart women. I am a badass at seeing smart woman and helping them tap into their potential. It's been a journey to get there, but I'm like, "Yeah, I can see I can do that."

Claire Yee (26:29):
Yes. I love that and it is a journey and that's the beauty of just starting where you're at. We don't need to know where we're going in the long run.

Salome Schillack (26:37):
Correct. Yeah.

Claire Yee (26:39):
You knew you had a skill in Facebook ads and you just started that there. Then you grew through that and you developed your next superpower and then your next superpower and each one unlocks the next like a little dominoes.

Claire Yee (26:55):
We don't need to see the final end version of ourselves when we first start. But it's following those breadcrumbs and just doing it. Getting out there, doing it and trying it and yeah.

Salome Schillack (27:16):
You have been such a part of this journey that I've been on because you've been in my community for two years now, more than two years. So I love that you have seen how I went from just talking about Facebook ads to now where I'm at the point where I almost never talk about Facebook ads. I talk more about my marketing and woo woo and just emotions and just our human experience as online course creators. How does someone who feel like they would love to be able to tap into their emotion more in their business? Is there something we can do? What are the questions we can ask ourselves to get curious and what can we do to really practice tapping into our intuition more?

Claire Yee (28:14):
Yeah. The first step is just really that practice of awareness and how does it feel? How is my body feeling? What are the emotions? Are they feeling constrictive, intense, or are they feeling expansive and allowing, and free and joyous? There's obviously the continuum. I like to think of it like a spiral. So you've got at the bottom of the spiral of the tension and the fear and the anxiety. And we do go up and down the spiral a lot in our businesses and some things we need to do. We just need to get over the fear, which we can talk about another time.

Claire Yee (28:53):
But when we're making decisions and following those breadcrumbs, it's really tuning in with how the body's feeling, the emotions. Emotions are energy in motion. They're speaking to us and the constrictive feelings are often those ones, if it's feeling constrictive, the decision, it's a good sign it's not aligned with your highest path.

Claire Yee (29:22):
If the decision to you feels when you feel into the decision and feel what that would create in your life and for the lives of others, if that feels really expansive and you feel relaxed and you're just breathing more deeply when you feel into it and your shoulders just relax, or you feel little heart flutters or bubbles of joy, that everyone senses it in a different way and the more we play around with it, the more we can fine tune our sense of it. That's where we just have this knowing that that's right. It's like, "I know that this is right."

Claire Yee (30:02):
There's a strength in your voice when you share it with others. It's like, "I know that this is my next step." It's not, "This could be my next step, but I'm not really sure and what about this or what about that?" We're not analyzing and questioning and it's just following that abundant knowing feeling. Does that make sense in the way I describe it just now?

Salome Schillack (30:29):
It does. It does. The abundant knowing, it makes total sense. It's you already know what you want.

Claire Yee (30:38):
Yeah, you do. And sometimes it's just taking the space to listen to it.

Salome Schillack (30:45):
Yeah. I was stuck on something a while ago and I have two business besties. They've both been on the podcast, Maria in Germany and Tony. They both said to me, "Just what do you want? What do you want? Just what do you want?" And I went, "Oh, I've been so stuck thinking about what I didn't want that I forgot that. To choose what I want. And I feel like our intuition sets in that wall of sometimes we forget that it's even an option. Leaning to what we want. Right? What we want.

Claire Yee (31:24):
Yeah, and it's often the thinking. When we're overthinking things, that's when we get stuck and it's that analyzing and thinking and that has its place, but listening, the intuition isn't in the head thinking, analyzing.

Salome Schillack (31:38):
No, it's not.

Claire Yee (31:40):
The intuition comes from a space within it. It can be the heart. It can be in the core. For me, it's like, I feel it in the core of my body and it comes from this inner internal core space rather than this thinking kind of space.

Salome Schillack (31:57):
Absolutely.

Claire Yee (31:57):
Yeah, and when you just breathe, just a simple practice of breathing into your belly, expanding your belly, settling your central nervous system so you can feel it. What do I want? What feels right?

Salome Schillack (32:14):
Yeah. Yeah. What feels right? What do I want? I love that. I love that so much. Claire, if anybody wants to learn more about the work that you do, where can they find out about you?

Claire Yee (32:26):
So they can go to claireyee.com or motherglow.co.

Salome Schillack (32:31):
Oh, I love that mother glow.

Claire Yee (32:34):
Yes.

Salome Schillack (32:35):
Oh, that's beautiful. Dot co just .co.

Claire Yee (32:37):
Yes. That's right.

Salome Schillack (32:40):
Oh, fantastic. Claire, you are a rock for me. You are a rock for the Launch Lounge students and I am just so lucky to have you as our guide along this path. So thank you so much for everything you give to the Launch Loungers and thank you for what you give to me and to everyone else. I have loved being part of your journey and I'm so grateful you're part of mine.

Claire Yee (33:03):
Oh, likewise. Thank you. I'm just so grateful to be a part of your world and a part of everything you create.

Salome Schillack (33:09):
Oh, fantastic. The best is yet to come.

Claire Yee (33:13):
Absolutely.

Salome Schillack (33:14):
Yes.

Claire Yee (33:16):
I love it.

Salome Schillack (33:17):
I'm so glad I could share even just this tiny little bit of Claire Yee with you guys. I have grown to love Claire like a sister. She's my sister on the other side of the ditch and for my American friends that means she's in New Zealand. We call that little piece of ocean between Australia and New Zealand, the ditch.

Salome Schillack (33:38):
So Claire shows up inside the Launch Lounge every other week and she is truly one of the cornerstones of what I would consider the success of the Launch Lounge and why so many women online course creators come to the Launch Lounge to really find a safe place where they can get support, mastermind, become friends with people who are like-minded, unpack their joys and sorrows and get all the support from the tactical like, "What the F do I do with my Facebook ads that are falling flat?" All the way to "I've lost my mojo. How do I get it back?" That's where Claire really shines.

Salome Schillack (34:26):
If you are one of those women and you're looking for a home, you're looking for a place where you can mastermind and hang out and get all the knowledge, all the training, but also the emotional support and the tactical support, then I want to invite you to come and join us inside the Launch Lounge. If you go to shineandsucceed.com/launch, get your name on the waitlist for the next time we open the doors to the Launch Lounge because you will know if you need to be there. You will know if this is your family and I would love to welcome you in.

Salome Schillack (35:05):
Of course, because it's a monthly membership, there is never any obligation. You can come and if it's not your jam, you get to go a month later. So if you are interested in getting your name on the waitlist, go to shineandsucceed.com/launch. Have a wonderful week. Bye.

Salome Schillack (35:32):
Thank you so much for listening. If you had fun, please come back next week and remember to hit that subscribe button so you never miss a thing.

159. Your Launch Failed.. Now What?

7 June 2022 | By Salome Schillack

listen now:

Let's talk about the F word.

Not that F word. I'm talking about failure.

You've spent months creating an online course. You're finally happy with it. The anticipation. The excitement. The adrenaline. Surely this is YOUR moment…..

But instead of hearing "cha-ching" from your bank account, you hear…..crickets.

UMMMM...what in the Zuckerberg is going on?

Hold on.

Before concluding you're a failure and selling online isn't your calling, or worse, that you're better off shutting down your online course, hear me out:

Failure is a critical part of success.

This week on The Shine Show, I get real with you. After years of experience and all the launches I've helped skyrocket to cyber success, a recent launch of mine flopped!

I know first hand how bad failure can feel. It's frustrating, confusing, consuming, and demotivating….but failure means you are one step closer to success. It's simply another way that didn't work!

Even though the results were vastly different to what I was expecting, and at the time I wanted to run away and hide, after unpacking the results I realized it hasn’t been a failure at all.

It’s been a huge learning curve that has opened up doors of phenomenal possibilities and new opportunities to win…big time!

And this isn't some Kumbaya campfire, airy-fairy, woo woo thing I'm telling you to make you feel good. A failed launch is actually a REALLY good thing. It means you have more data and experience, a better idea of where to pivot, and you are closer than ever to reaching success.

There's no need to unpack your results alone!

Tune in to the show and learn how to turn a setback into your greatest comeback, plus all the tea from my recent ‘failed’ launch to help you avoid the mistakes I made.

XXX

Salome

P.S If you are a committed online course launcher and you'd love to get the step-by-step formula to scaling your business fast, then The Launch Lounge is the place to be. Inside, you'll have access to industry experts, proven strategies that remove the guesswork, and tailored support that will suit your particular business because, as we all know, the 'one-size-fits-all' doesn't work! Ready to fast-track your success? Get on the waitlist here!

Subscribe and Review in iTunes Please!

When you subscribe and review the podcast not only does that give me the warm and fuzzies all over, it also helps other people to find the show.

When other people find the show they get to learn how to create more freedom in their lives from their online courses too!!

So do a good deed for all womenkind and subscribe and review this show and I will reward you with a shout out on the show!!

Links I mentioned in this episode:

Scroll down for a full transcript of this episode

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TRANSCRIPT

Hello, and welcome to episode number 159 of The Shine Show. Today's episode is called, Your launch failed, now what? And at the end of this episode, I want you to feel really heard and seen and know that every feeling about a launch that didn't go the way you wanted it to go is okay. And I also want you to know that there really is no such thing as failing when you really know what it means to build an online business.

(00:43):
Giving up your time and freedom to make money is so 2009. Hi, I'm your host, Salome Schillack and I help online course creators launch grow and scale their businesses with Facebook and Instagram ads so that they can make more money and have an even bigger impact in the world. If you are ready to be inspired, to dream bigger launch sooner and grow your online business faster then tune in because you are ready to shine. And this is The Shine Show.

(01:13):
Okay. You know that I am no stranger to lifting up my skirt and showing you my knickers. This is one of those episodes. I'm going to tell you about a launch that we did being the launch experts that we are - we launched. And yeah, it was a bit of not what we expected to launch, and I'm going to tell you about it. And then I want to talk to you about launches that fail and what to do about it.

So last year at the beginning of the year, so beginning of 2021, we did a launch for A-Lister and it was our biggest launch yet. That was the first month in my business that I made more than a hundred thousand dollars in one month. And it was a huge, happy, joyful occasion for me. And I celebrated the success thoroughly.

What I learned in that launch is something that I teach my students and something that I teach my clients and something that the launch loungers all know, and that is how to work out your most profitable customer journey. And what that means is you do some fancy spreadsheet work that I teach inside the launch lounge, to know where the people came from, who ended up buying your course, because you can be running ads for your webinar, or you could be running ads for your lead magnet until the cows come home. But unless you know, that lead magnet or that webinar actually resulted in people buying your course, you were just chasing cheap leads. And what we noticed was the majority of the people who bought A-Lister in 2021 were people who were already familiar to us. They were in our warm audiences.

So they were already on our email list. And that's great. It's good information to know, because then you can replicate that. So now I knew that what I need to do next is I need to build my list tremendously, and then invite only the people on my list to the webinar. If I want to grow this launch. What I did not take into account was, a) The effect of iOS one year later, b. The effect of the world economy one year later, and c. The effect of something going really weird in our email list and our email open rates suddenly plummeting. There's something else we learned later too, is that all of the lead gen ads that we ran were actually such poor quality leads that also contributed to negative writings on our email, but also in our launch. So I went into the launch this year in March, based on the data I had collected a year ago.

And that data told me, build my email list and launched to my email list and did not take all the other things into account, which I couldn't have known because you don't know these things until the fat lady has sung. And the game is over on your launch and your cart is closed and you are left with results that either meet your expectation or didn't meet your expectation. And if it didn't meet your expectation, we use the F word. No, not that one. Fail, that one. We use the F word, if it did not meet our expectation. Well, the other one may be a little bit too, but we also create negative feelings. We have negative feelings, and that's why we call it failure, is because it feels yucky because we put money into this and we pour our emotions into this. And we set our expectations for the future based on historic performance.

And we think we're very smart and we think we know a lot. And then entrepreneurship happens and it is not pretty. What ended up happening is I was so confident that this plan of mine is going to work, that I spent $30,000 in the first three months of 2022 on list building. I went hard on list building, and I used conversion ads, like I teach you to do. And I used lead gen ads, like I teach you to do. And I was willing to risk the Lead Gen ads, not being quality ads, because I wanted top quality leads because I wanted to taste it. I wanted to see because for some people in some niches they're great, for others in other niches, they're not. So I dropped my 30K and then our email open rates started dropping and dropping and dropping and dropping and dropping and dropping and dropping steadily.

And I wasn't paying too much attention to it. I was busy with other things. And then we sent out webinar invitations, and we had about a third of the registrations we required. And we had about a third of the webinar registrations proportionately that we had a year ago. And we hosted the webinars. And I don't know if you've been on my A-Lister webinar. If you've been on my A-Lister webinar, send me a DM and tell me how much fun my A-Lister webinar is. I mean, I can honestly say, I don't think there's anyone else who dresses up in feathers and who is as entertaining as I am. I can claim that when talking about Facebook ads, maybe when talking about marketing in general, I pride myself on how entertaining my webinar is and what I love about our webinar is people stay until the end. They stay all the way through. They love the A-Lister webinar. They stay and they stay and I'm waiting for them to buy and they're not buying.

And they send me messages and they say, they love the webinar, but they don't buy. And I'm not sure what's going on. And my emails don't get opened and my messages aren't landing with them and they're not clicking. And it's this weird cyber quiet that you would never expect in the middle of a launch, just this weird cyber quiet. And at the end of that launch we did a few things to increase the sales and pulled a few hats out of rabbits, rabbits out of hats. And I genuinely believe that the students who should have been there are there and the ones who shouldn't isn't. And I know in my heart of hearts, that it is exactly the way that it should be, but I had to take a moment to get to that place to say, hold on. This is exactly the way it should be, because my expectation was that it was going to be different.

My expectation was that it was going to be financially a different outcome. And so I had to very quickly adjust my expectation, which goes along with adjusting my plans for growth in the business for 2022, which goes along with suddenly a lot of things I thought I was going to be able to do. I can't do anymore because the cash just isn't there, or I have to find the cash somewhere else. But the bottom line is I had a financial expectation and my expectation wasn't met. I ended up making my 30K back, but I didn't make any profit. Who else? Tell me one other online course launch marketer teacher, who would tell you that. I want you to know that because I want you to know that I get real with you. And even with all the years of experience, this happens to us as well.

Now, since then, I've spoken to a whole bunch of my friends and a whole bunch of colleagues and a whole bunch of other smart marketing people in the industry. And it seems it's a bit of a... I want to call it a pandemic going around for people like us. People who sell on... I call it like vague online marketing niches. We teach you that the riches is in the niches. And then we build businesses on building online course. And it's not a niche at all because I have clients in the interior design space whose launches for creating a business has done tremendously well, we have a student in the launch lounge who teaches people how to start a business as a doula. And she has done it tremendously well. People who teach people how to start businesses selling flowers, do tremendously well.

People teaching people how to create businesses, turning their art into sellable things, digital things they do very well. It's these double niches. It's not just create an online business. It's create an online business in a specific niche. They're doing very well, but us general, start an online business, start an online courses business. I believe that it's because we're not niche enough. And it's also because I've heard this from all of us in the same sort of space, but the evidence suggests that those who are in niche specific industries, they are still doing really well. So why do I tell you this? Because I want to reframe what failing really means. I want to share with you what data you have to look at and learn from before you throw the baby out with the bath water, which I see so many people do.

It's tempted when you have that feeling of disappointment to just go, "Oh, this is just never going to work." And then throw the baby out with water or to suddenly make such a large pivot that you have to basically start from scratch or like me, like what I did why back in 2016, go back to your day job. Yeah, we don't want to do that. I want to explore with you in this episode, what you are going to do now, if your launch failed to meet your own mental and emotional needs and the financial needs of your family so that you can move forward with joy, with lightheartedness, with fun and with playfulness as you continue to explore your journey and how that unfolds. So let's talk about what does failing really even mean because as far as I'm concerned, when I think back about where I learned the meaning of failure, I think about school.

I think about sitting in a classroom for a year and being taught, let's say 12 or 13 or 24 chapters from a handbook. And let's say every month I had to memorize the content of a specific chapter. I don't know why I'm specifically thinking back at my biology class, but I'm thinking about biology and how one semester was all about cells. And I remember the mitochondria and all the things. The nucleus and all the things in cells. I literally remember memorizing these things like a parrot. And then you get to the halfway mark of the year and they test how well you've memorized these things. And if you've done a great job memorizing things, you either pass the test or you fail the test.

And so there's a degree of understanding principles that were taught to you in math and science and a degree of memorization in history and biology, you just have to memorize the stuff and regurgitate it. And if you're like me and you can cram a whole lot of information into your head in a really short time, then you pass. Even if you go on a coffee diet and don't sleep much two days before, like I did in my final year of school, but you can clearly see, I don't remember much from biology.

I have blocked everything from science out, but in school we learn that there is such a thing as passing or failing and the passing or failing is determined by how well we can memorize something compared to our peers. This is important. You pass or you fail based on how well you can record regurgitate, remember, and action compared to your peers. Think about that for a second. Think about that when you are in an online course or a membership like the launch lounge, and you feel you are behind, or you feel you are just not as good as insert star students name, or you feel you want to hold back. Because the question you want to ask might be not such a smart question.

It comes from school when we were compared to our peers, when we were told there's one straight line towards passing and that straight line is determined by how well we do the things that someone else tells us to do. And I want to challenge that today. I want to challenge that belief because so many of us start off with a great idea and we think we should set a goal to help us achieve that. And maybe that goal is to grow our lists to a hundred people in 10 days, or maybe the goal is to sell 20 coaching packages in this launch.

And those goals become kind of passing the exam. If I hit my goal, I've passed the exam, which also means that if I didn't hit my goal, that must mean I failed and therefore I must be behind, but how can anyone else be competing in the same game as you? How can anyone else be on the same pathway as you? How can anyone else even remotely be the person who gets to decide whether you're far enough into deep enough onto all the success measures? Every milestone, every ruler, every parameter we use that has that dichotomy of pass versus fail on it.

How can anyone else impose parameters like that on us? And how can they in any way, shape or form have the same parameters as us? Because no one does, nobody, not the person who's in the same niche as you, not the person who is also single mom, not the person who also has three jobs, not the person who also has nine kids, not the person who also is sitting in a day job still because none of us have the same gifts. None of us have the same creativity. None of us have the same brain capacity. None of us have the same imagination. None of us have the same desire to make this very specific change. The very specific impact that you want to make. And so therefore I want you to consider for a second, that what you learned in school is failure has absolutely nothing to do with your journey. As an entrepreneur, it is impossible to fail at this.

There is nothing that you can lose and yes, I mean money by that as well. There is nothing that you can lose because you cannot lose when your goal is to explore how this works. You cannot lose when your goal is to explore how this will spark joy for you. You cannot lose when your goal is to see how many people's lives you can impact and change and help. You cannot lose when your goal is to see how many people you can connect with and move them to a space where you can help them. You cannot lose at this. It is impossible. When we feel like we've failed, it's because we have a comparison to that preconceived expectation. It's a black and white, there's a score we get. And when we hit the goal, we set out to hit, we pass. And when we don't, we fail. The trick here is to know you are on a journey. And to know that the results you get in your launch is only an indication of where to go next.

All right, now I want to change the tone a little bit, because now that we know that nothing is lost, nothing is gained. Nothing is right, nothing is wrong, nothing is broken. It's all just one giant game. Let's turn our attention to what to do next. Inside the launch lounge, I teach our students that there are many variables that they need to consider when they're launching their courses. There are different ways of tasting your product. There's different ways of tasting your message, your offer, your audience and your market. We don't just swap and change and stop and start without actually analyzing the data from our launches. Because if there are 10 data points that you need to track, because there are 10 different actions people needed to take as they move through your launch or as they move through your funnel. And five of the data points were executed exceptionally well.

And your data hits all the points that you needed it to hit. And five of the other data points did not. Then you have at least half of places in your funnel where you can do different things and half that you need to keep the same, that you should not change because they already work. And it could be that just one of those five makes all the difference suddenly if you get.

If my email open rate was higher in that launch lounge, in that A-Lister launch, if my email open rate had been higher, then I would've had more webinar, registrants and more webinar registrants. If all things stayed the same, would've made more sales. So it could be one place in your funnel where you lost most of your traffic. And that can make all the difference. Now, if you throw the baby out with a bath water and you decide, well, it failed. And so I am not going to do anything else about it. Then you deny yourself the joy of seeing what actually worked and just because it didn't result in money, doesn't mean a lot of things didn't go really well. So if we consider that there are three main things in every launch that needs to happen. You need an audience, you need traffic.

You usually get that either from social media or from ads or from your email list or a combination of the three, you also need an offer. You need to have a compelling offer. Something that somebody really wants and is willing to part with the amount of money you're asking for it, willingly and joyfully and a sales page and email copy that goes along with that offer. And it needs to be good. And the third piece that you need, that needs to be... I want to use the word say funnel appropriate is a launch mechanism. And what do I mean by that? I mean, a webinar, a video series, a challenge, a live event, a workshop, something, it's the thing that you invite people to where you take them on a sales journey. And at the end of you say, "The cart is now open." Now some of those mechanisms are more expensive to fill like webinars. So it doesn't make sense to run ads to a webinar. If you're selling a $27 product, does make sense to send them to a prerecorded video on a sales page.

Maybe it makes sense if you're selling a $2,000 course to create a three part video series, maybe if you're selling a two $97 thing to create a five day challenge, see the launch mechanism that you use is determined by the price point and the price point again has an impact on the size of your audience. So you can see how these three things, your audience, your offer that has a price attached to it. And your launch mechanism are really kind of forms a vein diagram. And the three things need to work well together. And unless you have the support of someone like me or my team, then it might be harder for you to figure out which one of those three things worked, which one didn't, which parts within the three worked or didn't. So metrics that I want to share with you here. So you can start working on this right now that you can analyze and use to analyze your data.

When you're looking at your launch, results is number one. Did you get enough people to your launch event? Number two, did they show up for your launch event? Number three, did they actually hear the pitch? Because it's possible that they showed up for two thirds of the webinar or they opened the first two of the four videos, emails that you sent, but they didn't actually open video number three and number four. So did they actually hear the pitch? Did they see your sales page? A lot of people come to me crying because they didn't make any sales. And I say, "Well, how many people did you have on your sales page?" And they say, "Oh, there were eight people on my sales page." And I go, "That is statistically insignificant."

We need statistically significant number of people on there. Because if the rule of thumb is that 10%, 20%, 5%, 2% of people on your sales page are going to convert. Then eight people's not going to get you there. And the last thing I ask everyone at the end of a launch who feels dissatisfied with their results is, did you survey them to find out why they didn't buy? Definitely send out a survey to all the non buyers, find out why they didn't buy nine out of 10 times it's going to be money or time. Money or time is never really a reason. Only rarely a reason. If they say money or time, then there are always things you can do to help them see that your course is worth their money and their time. So it kind of comes back to your offer when they say money or time.

I want you to know that not many people. In fact, I think in all the years that I've been doing this, I have maybe come across one or two people out of thousands and thousands who were fortunate enough to have a great idea for a course, set up some ads and make a great profit right from day one. They are unicorns. Probably best for my and your sanity that we accept. We are not unicorns, but there's so much joy in the journey. And if all this is feeling it's too much pressure for you and you don't see the light at the end of the tunnel, please know that it's okay and you are okay.

You, your life, your business, it's all a journey. It's all a game. It's all an experiment. When our babies are learning to walk and they fall down, what do we do? We don't tell them to quit. We tell them to keep trying. We play games with them. We encourage them. We go stand a little bit further. We find a bright colored toy. We nurture them every time we they fall, we tell them it's okay. We give them the courage to stand up and know that it is still safe. It is still safe to learn to walk. Even if you fell down and they naturally keep getting up and eventually they're running all over the place and you are exhausted for a whole nother reason.

So why can't we give ourselves the same love, the same patience and the same understanding of that learning cycle. Our mental health is so important in every aspect of our lives, but even moreso when we feel what we want to achieve, isn't working. I know it's cliched and I know I've touched on it already, but we need to remember that quote that Oprah says, "There is no such thing as failure. Failure is just life trying to move us in another direction." It's just life trying to move us in another direction.

I want to actually expand on that and say, failure is just life trying to move us in a better direction. And we just can't yet see what is better because we haven't been there. So go gently in another direction, explore your mental and emotional needs and the financial needs of your family so that you can take responsibility and do what you need to do to make sure you are providing for your family. While you figure this thing out, give yourself the love and the patience and the kindness that you need so that you can move forward with joy, lightheartedness, fun, and playfulness.

And remember that you decide how your journey will unfold. Not your peers. You don't have peers. There are no peers because no one is on the journey you're on. And after you've analyzed your data, after you've looked those numbers in the eyes, be kind to yourself and try not to let the heaviness take over. The lighter you can feel the better you'll be able to pick up and move on in a new positive direction with renewed energy and hope and with a new sense of creation, because that is what you're doing here in the first place you're using your creative energy to create.

And that creation that you are going to sell to other people is going to spark new joy, spark new things for them. So hold on to that and know that there is always hope. So I think you will see if you're paying attention to the things that I'm doing and to A-Lister. I think you'll see that we are having fun with it. We're playing with it. We're trying to really listen to you, to anyone else who is wondering about it. We're really trying to hear what it is that this new space that we find ourselves in, what it is that we need to hear in order to bring a product that is a phenomenal product to more people in a way that they can see that it is a good thing that will serve them. So keep a lookout at what I'm doing. Feel free to send me an email, feel free to send me a DM.

I would love to hear from you and go lightly my friend, be kind to yourself. If things aren't exactly where you want them to be, have a great week. Bye.

If you love this episode and you are a committed online course launcher who wants to learn how to grow your profits in your next course launch. And you want to know how to successfully scale your online courses business to seven figures and beyond then I'd love to see you inside the launch lounge.

The launch lounge is the only community online that is dedicated solely to helping you develop every aspect of your online courses business so that you can build your business to scale. No one size fits all solutions, just the right education you need when you need it. Coaching from our team of experts in different areas of launching and scaling and the best community on the internet. The launch lounge is your online course building home. If you want profitable launches that scale your business to seven figures and beyond.

To get on the wait list for our next enrollment season, go to shineandsucceed.com/launch.

158. Learning To Value Slow Progress Over Instant Success When Chasing Your Dreams with Diane Evans

31 May 2022 | By Salome Schillack

listen now:

The business dream isn't always so dreamy. So how do you continue with confidence when it feels like everyone around you is so uncertain about where you’re going?

This week we're going to get real vulnerable....

We're all about authenticity in The Launch Lounge, and yes, we do share the perceived wins. But we're also committed to keepin’ it real and sharing the perceived losses.

The world tells us success should be instant. So it's no wonder many of us walk around feeling like utter failures because a 6 figure launch didn't happen immediately!

It takes a while for things to start coming together.
It takes time before financial results start flying through.

And it's all part of the journey, and it's a really good thing because it allows you to get crystal clear on the bits that are working (and ready to scale) and the bits that are wasting your time and resources.

But I get it. At times, growing an online course can feel like eating dry cardboard. Data, patience, testing, trialing, zero sales....it can feel like all your hard work is going down the drain.

But it's in this very moment when it all feels too hard; you need all the hope, support, understanding, and patience in the world to keep going because you're well on the way to seeing incredible results. Believe me, it’s going to happen!

It's also at this moment when a shiny, bright bajillion-dollar successful launch story can make you want to throw a hammer at your laptop and scream, WHEN IS IT MY TURN!

So this week on The Shine Show, we're going to get honest about the online course journey. The highs, the lows, and everything in between.

My courageous, brilliant student Diane Evans from PhotoFluent transparently & bravely shares her online course journey. Even though her course teaches travellers to take photos they feel proud of, her business journey has been anything but picture perfect. Rather than giving up, Diane has stuck to her vision and found a way to keep the hope alive, find confidence within herself, and stay true to her dream.

If you're losing hope and feeling like things are taking forever to happen, this episode is exactly for you. Don't let the feeling of failure shape your future. Tune in now and hear Diane's story for yourself! It'll inspire you to keep going even when it feels tough.

XXX
Salome

P.S. The Launch Lounge doors are opening for a limited time only. One of the things that can make or break your success is the community you surround yourself with. A community that supports you, cheers you on, and understands a growing list is JUST AS exciting as a full bank account. The Launch Lounge will fast track your progress and show you how to get results without wasting time & money along the way. It seriously pays for itself. Spots are strictly limited, so make sure your name is on the waitlist!

Subscribe and Review in iTunes Please!

When you subscribe and review the podcast not only does that give me the warm and fuzzies all over, it also helps other people to find the show.

When other people find the show they get to learn how to create more freedom in their lives from their online courses too!!

So do a good deed for all womenkind and subscribe and review this show and I will reward you with a shout out on the show!!

Links I mentioned in this episode:

Drool over Diane's photography

Scroll down for a full transcript of this episode

more episodes

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174. Some Thoughts On Making Lots Of Money

173. 3 Reasons NOW Is The Best Time To Start A Digital Courses Business with Amy Porterfield

172. 25 Biggest Lessons In Online Marketing I Learned From Amy Porterfield

171. Social Media: One Thing That Makes All The Effort Worthwhile

170. How to Choose the Right Name for Your Online Course

169. Content Planning For Posts VS Content For Your Course And Launches

168. Managing Your Money As A Small Business Owner with Darcie Milfeld

167. 3 Lies You Were Told About Hiring An Ads Manager

166. How To Create Your Online Course Faster with Gina Onativia

165. The Only Way Low Dollar Offers Are Working Today

164. New Ad Targeting Options That Are Working Now

TRANSCRIPT

Salome Schillack (00:00:00):
Hello, and welcome to episode number 158 of The Shine Show. Today's show is called Learning to Value Slow Progress Over Instant Success When Chasing Your Dreams, and I'm interviewing one of my favorite students, Diane Evans. Diane is a Launch Lounger. She's not just any Launch Lounger. She's a VIP Launch Lounger, and Diane is a photographer and the founder of PhotoFluent where she teaches travelers how to turn down the volume of their inner critic, develop the confidence to be creative with their camera, and take travel photos that capture their beautiful memories. She's been studying photography for over 20 years. It didn't always come easily to her, and she came back from way too many trips with bad photos, but once she figured out the technology and connected that to the creative aspect of making travel photos, she wanted to help other women travelers do the same, and she does that through online courses and coaching, in person retreats, her blog, and her YouTube channel.

Salome Schillack (00:01:09):
She and her husband, Neil, lived in France for a year where she honed her photographic storytelling skills. Now, they live in Sacramento, California with their sweet dog, Maggie, but Diane dreams of the day they can move back to France where she plans to host PhotoFluent retreats for women travelers who want to connect with their creativity and cameras. And I have to say, I really have to commend Diane for sharing bravely and vulnerably today on the show her journey of ups and downs. If you're in the Launch Lounge, you know that it really matters to me that we don't just share perceived wins. We also share perceived losses. We share the up and the downs because it's all part of the journey, and it is just false to pretend that it's all up, up, up all the time. So, without further ado, let's listen to my interview with Diane Evans.

Salome Schillack (00:02:14):
Giving up your time and freedom to make money is so 2009. Hi, I'm your host Salome Schillack, and I help online course creators launch, grow, and scale their businesses with Facebook and Instagram ads so that they can make more money and have an even bigger impact in the world. If you're ready to be inspired to dream bigger, launch sooner, and grow your online business faster, than tuning because you are ready to shine, and this is The Shine Show.

Salome Schillack (00:02:48):
Diane, thank you so much for joining me. I am very excited to share your journey with all of the listeners today.

Diane Evans (00:02:56):
I have to say I'm thrilled to be here, and it was always kind of one of my dreams ever since I started listening to your podcast to be here and here I am.

Salome Schillack (00:03:04):
Yes. Here you are, and you're one of my all time favorite. I mean, I say that about everyone, but you are one of my favorite students. You're in the Launch Lounge and you're in Launch Lounge VIP, and you are just tenacious. I love that about you. And so, today, I have invited Diane on the show to tell us her story, and we are going to talk about the ups and downs of getting a business off the ground and what that takes. So, Diane, just, I think you are at heart an entrepreneur, but tell us a little bit about how you moved from day job to entrepreneur.

Diane Evans (00:03:50):
It's funny that you say that I'm at heart because I have never really believed that. I hear people say, "I've been an entrepreneur since I was nine years old because I had a lemonade stand," and that wasn't me. I went from high school to college to job. I was an occupational therapist, and I didn't really like it, but I just kept doing it because it paid the bills. So, I would switch jobs a lot, and I tried a lot of different areas of healthcare. I was in project management. I was a clinical specialist. I did sales. I did it all in healthcare, and I didn't like any of it, but I didn't have the courage to push myself out because that is what I had experience in. That's what I had my degrees in, And so I just kept doing it, and it took me into my fifties to finally say-

Salome Schillack (00:04:41):
By the way, I cannot believe, when I read you're 50, you're in your late thirties. So, whatever you're drinking, I want some of that.

Diane Evans (00:04:49):
Thank you. Oh, I do love you so much, Salome. Yeah, and the sad thing too is my dad did not like his career, and I always was determined I will not be like him. I will not do what my dad did and just continue on in a job he didn't like for his whole life, and yet, all of a sudden, I thought, "I've done that." And so, when I decided then it's time, it was really my late forties where I decided, "Okay," and I had the support. Before I was single, I was alone, and I just had to support myself, and when I got married and we started talking, that's when I decided photography is my true love and that is what I wanted to do. You don't make a living as a photographer. In my head, that's what I've heard. You need a paycheck, you need benefits, and all of that. But I just decided it was time to figure it out because some people do, right?

Salome Schillack (00:05:54):
Yeah, yeah. Oh, I want to dive into so much of what you just said, so much. Firstly, I am a hundred percent with you in that I never believed I was an entrepreneur because I followed such a traditional path, and here's why I think today if you ask me am I a born entrepreneur, I would say hells yes, but if you asked me a few years ago before I had success as an entrepreneur, before I learned how to make money, before I learned how to find my audience and sell to them, before I learned how to turn courses into money, I would've said the same thing, no, I'm not because I've never sold a thing in my life. I always feel icky when I'm selling. Well, back before, I was like, "Selling is icky," and yet I was a salesperson, just like you, pharmaceutical rep.

Salome Schillack (00:07:00):
But here's what I want to say to you, and I hope this serves a lot of the listeners out there, the reason I look at you and I go, "Diane Evans, you are born entrepreneur," is because people like you and me, we are too damn creative. We are too damn creative for traditional jobs. We are too rebellious. We cannot be contained. We cannot be spreadsheeted. I remember feeling so spreadsheeted, spreadshited. We cannot be told not to do new things. We cannot be told not to listen to the burning passion in our hearts. And if you grew up in a family where you were modeled you get a job, you get a solid income, you go to uni, you get a degree, you study, you have a professional job like I was, then entrepreneurship is a hard skill to learn even if you're a born entrepreneur.

Salome Schillack (00:08:31):
There are people who are just not made for this. You and I were made for this, but there's so much unlearning that has to happen, and so much learning that has to happen, skills, just plain skills that needs to happen that it's easy to think, "Well, I'm not a born entrepreneur because this is so hard." And what I want to say to you is no, no, that's just part of the journey. You, Diane, are a born entrepreneur.

Diane Evans (00:09:04):
I just had a little aha moment when you said all of that. That is why I didn't like any job. I thought I just picked the wrong profession, but it's because I did, I felt stifled and trapped. I felt like they were sucking my soul out every single day, and I just kept thinking, "Something's wrong with me," but you're right. I was meant to be an entrepreneur. I just didn't know how to do that.

Salome Schillack (00:09:30):
Yes. I had the exact same experience. It didn't matter what I did with the exception of when I did musical theater, and I'll talk about that in a second as well because I want to touch on that. Every job, it didn't matter how, I would literally just start the job in order to win at it, and as soon as I won at it, I was bored. I needed the next thing to move on because we are creators, and here's not a difference between a creator and an entrepreneur. The only distinguishing factor is creators don't all create to turn it into capital, but all entrepreneurs are creators because they create in order to turn it into capital. So, there are areas in your life where you can create and it doesn't have to turn into capital, but when you can create and you can turn that into capital, you get to live from this burning fire in your heart, and it gets to pay your bills, supply your external world because that's all that money does is it just supplies our external world, but that's pretty important.

Diane Evans (00:11:06):
Yeah. Right.

Salome Schillack (00:11:08):
Yeah. So, I wonder how you feel about that.

Diane Evans (00:11:15):
I think, yeah, I feel like I've made this big shift just having this conversation with you because I do feel like I just had no... I didn't have the skills to do it. I didn't know I was supposed to do it, and now suddenly when I decided to do it, like you said, it's a steep learning curve to figure all that out. I'm used to having it kind of spoon-fed to me, and sitting at a desk, and having everything structured which is safe, but like you, I'd get bored. I'd get bored and I'd switch jobs. I mean, like single year, I'd switch jobs and I'd have a new one, and then as soon as I'd get to the place where I think, "Okay, I get this," boom, I had to have another job.

Salome Schillack (00:12:00):
Yeah, yeah, I know exactly what you mean.

Diane Evans (00:12:05):
It's terrifying to not know what's coming and what you're doing. I love learning, so that part of it, I love. Just all the software and the systems and all that, it's been fun, but I don't have a paycheck coming in while I do that. So it's stressful. I lived in Boulder, Colorado for a while and there's a mindset there. I think of an entrepreneur as someone who creates software and then sells it and makes millions of dollars. This online business, course creation, chugging along, plugging along, making a little bit here, making a little bit there, that's not what I envisioned at all, but that's also an entrepreneur, just like a lemonade stand is, right?

Salome Schillack (00:12:56):
Correct. Yeah, correct. I don't know if this is true for you, but it definitely, if I look back at the time, the three years that I put in when I started the business and the three years that it went nowhere financially or... Well, no, it actually did go somewhere. It went into $40,000 debt. That's exactly where it went, but the learning went somewhere else, the learning. But if I think about how I felt back then, I would not have described myself as an entrepreneur because I felt like success is a precursor to calling yourself an entrepreneur, and that's just not true. That is just not true.

Diane Evans (00:13:43):
And it's hard to respond to people when they say, "How is your business going?" I don't even like to talk about it because when they say that, I want to say... I don't know. What's the right answer? I'm making profit. You can't say, "I have a great email list. I'm building this incredible Facebook group." People don't understand that. They want to know are you making money at it, and so for the first few years, I don't even know how to respond to the question.

Salome Schillack (00:14:14):
Yeah. Yeah. That's a good question. That is a good question. How do you respond to that? I remember feeling exactly the same way, and my answer was always, "It's going great."

Diane Evans (00:14:24):
Great.

Salome Schillack (00:14:25):
It's fantastic.

Diane Evans (00:14:28):
Yeah.

Salome Schillack (00:14:28):
And in my heart, I'd going, "Yeah, I'm doing a great job building my audience, but I haven't sold a thing."

Diane Evans (00:14:36):
Right.

Salome Schillack (00:14:38):
But I wouldn't tell them that.

Diane Evans (00:14:40):
People talk about imposter syndrome, and I always thought, "I don't know that I feel that," because I feel like I really know my subject matter. When I teach photography to travelers, I know what I'm talking about, and I love it. So, I don't feel like with my students I have imposter syndrome, but boy, does it rear its ugly head when somebody asks me about my business.

Salome Schillack (00:14:59):
Yeah, because somewhere in there, there's still a belief that it has to make money in order for it to be real.

Diane Evans (00:15:07):
And a lot of money.

Salome Schillack (00:15:08):
Yeah, and a lot of money.

Diane Evans (00:15:10):
Yeah.

Salome Schillack (00:15:12):
Yeah. Do you think that's stopping you?

Diane Evans (00:15:16):
Oh, I've done so much mindset stuff. I think there's whole lot of things stopping me, but yeah, I think it's a marriage. That's what drew me to you, Salome, is that you're the logistics and the fact person married with woo-woo.

Salome Schillack (00:15:35):
I love that.

Diane Evans (00:15:36):
And that's what I loved about your podcast, and that's what I love about your approach is it's not all just visualizing and believing you can. That's equally as important, but I also have to learn how to make it happen.

Salome Schillack (00:15:51):
I love that. That's so funny. You're the second person who's described me that way in the last month. What did you say, the data person married to the woo-woo person? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I love the woo-woo, but let's substantiate it with data.

Diane Evans (00:16:04):
Right. I need facts, yeah.

Salome Schillack (00:16:07):
Yeah. Yeah. I need facts too, but I also know that the woo-woo is factual. It's just, I can't see the fact, but [inaudible 00:16:17].

Diane Evans (00:16:16):
Right, in a different way, right.

Salome Schillack (00:16:18):
In a different way, yeah. Okay. So, how long ago did you start PhotoFluent?

Diane Evans (00:16:25):
About two and a half years now.

Salome Schillack (00:16:27):
Okay. What's that journey? Tell us, how did it start? Tell me a little bit about your two and a half years of getting it off the ground.

Diane Evans (00:16:37):
You know, I had this beautiful moment where I started a local photography business, and I quickly realized I wanted something online that would give us location independence because I want to move to France. So, that's my goal. And so, I started hearing from friends and family, "I got this nice camera, I'm going on these great trips, but I'm not getting photos that I like." And all of a sudden, it was like this beautiful woo-woo moment that said, "You are meant to do this. You are meant to teach women travelers how to develop confidence in their creative skills with the camera." Boom, there it was. It became so clear, and then the name, everything just fell into place like it was meant to be, and then the falling into place immediately came to a screeching halt.

Diane Evans (00:17:29):
I came to you through DCA, like most people, with Amy Porterfield. I started my online course creation, and the website and the email service part. There's so many moving parts and pieces, and I got all of that going, and I keep moving forward, I keep progressing, but I'm still not making a lot of money at it. So, there's also been this kind of emotional rollercoaster of I'm a failure. You see these success stories on podcasts and think, "Well, they had a $10,000 launch the first time out. They had a $100,000 year their first year, second year, and I'm not, so what's wrong with me."

Diane Evans (00:18:12):
So, there's been, I would say, equally as much website messaging, marketing, training, learning as mindset, and I'm not a failure, and I am an entrepreneur, and I can do this, believing in myself, pushing past the fear of failure, all of that stuff. It's so complicated. I work harder. I'm more stressed than I was with any job my whole life, but I love it more which doesn't even really make practical sense, does it?

Salome Schillack (00:18:45):
I understand that perfectly. I understand that perfectly, and it's one of my absolute values. It's something I promote a lot is the idea that we should not just be talking about the financial wins because that is not the journey. The journey is not just about hearing about the person who made a $100,000 in the first year or the million-dollar launch. The journey is about the journey. The success is the failure. The failure is the success, and it's this traditional belief that we have that we have to succeed straight away. That comes from school. In school, you got a grade. You took a test and you got a grade and you knew very well how you fared in that test, whereas with this, no one's grading us along the way. No one's telling us if we're doing it right along the way.

Salome Schillack (00:19:46):
We have to go all the way to close to get to our result, and then if the only way we grade ourselves is on how much money I made, of course, if it didn't yet sell, you give yourself an F. But what if you give yourself an A-plus for analyzing the right data and knowing where to make the change for next time? That would look a little bit differently.

Diane Evans (00:20:28):
Yeah, I'm in a new phase of my business, and that's what you've helped me get to is we're looking at this as data. I'm going through launch right now, and I'm detached from the results, and I always say that going in, "I'm detached from results. This is just data collection," but I never have been. I'm always devastated if I don't get the results I want.

Salome Schillack (00:20:49):
Of course.

Diane Evans (00:20:50):
But this time I feel like I really am. It's going to be okay. If this launch doesn't work out the way I want it to, then you and I are going to dig through that data. We're going to figure out, okay, how does it have to look different next time, and the next time, and maybe I don't do a webinar next time. Maybe I do a challenge. Whatever, there's a thousand different options, and finally, I feel like I'm not alone, and that's part of the journey too is I felt very isolated, and I joined Facebook groups, and I would take a course, but it's still like thousands of people in one group. And now, I finally feel like I'm not alone, and I do have the support, and I would say to people starting off, that's something you should get immediately to find your group of people that can support you, and it takes a while to find that.

Salome Schillack (00:21:42):
Yeah, it does. It can take a while. Do you know what I love about that, what you said? I think this is, like you said, where the woo-woo and the data comes together, when online course creators, we all, and me included, when I started, I just wanted someone to give me a simple recipe, right?

Diane Evans (00:22:05):
Yeah.

Salome Schillack (00:22:06):
And so, we sign up for all these courses that are pitched as the simple recipe, the step by step, the paint by numbers of how to do this thing, and we do the thing with the paint by numbers, and it doesn't work, and then we sign up for the other paint by numbers. So, maybe a webinar paint by numbers didn't work for me, so let me sign up to this other course where this person is promising me results with a paint by numbers challenge, and then that doesn't work, and then you sign up for the paint by numbers Facebook ads course, and then you run out of money, and that doesn't work.

Salome Schillack (00:22:49):
But the thing is the online courses are pitched at us as a step-by-step formula, and you and I both know there's nothing step-by-step formula about this. There's trial and error. There's underlying principles, and if you understand the underlying principles of how audiences move through funnels, and you're tracking the data of what happened as your audience moved through your funnels, then you can look at it and go, "I got a result." I can look at my data and understand my result as numbers, as only numbers, and then it's okay to be disappointed then if it didn't make money because we are still having a human experience.

Salome Schillack (00:23:46):
So, we should be emotional about that, and disappointment and anger and frustration are going to come with it, but that's not all there is. There is also, okay, now let me detach from this and look at the data, and I think that's the one thing most people do wrong is they are never in these step-by-step courses taught what data to track and how to interpret it and how to know how this group of people moved through a funnel to get to the other end, and they can't interpret that those numbers and make a decision, and so I love that you're seeing that and that you're seeing the value of that.

Diane Evans (00:24:28):
Yeah, I actually worked with a coach because you do need somebody to help you. You don't know what you don't know and to get into a Facebook group and ask questions, I didn't even know what questions to ask. So, I remember saying, "I have a landing page and I have an audience and I have an offer, and I have all these pieces, and communication to that audience. I don't understand which piece isn't working. Help me figure out which piece isn't working." And she said, "Oh, I don't really look at all of that. I just try it, and if it works, it works, and if it doesn't, I try something different." And I thought, "That's not how I roll." I'm not super analytical, but I got analytical in me, and I need to know what's broken and how to fix it because there's so many moving parts and pieces, and it can get very overwhelming.

Salome Schillack (00:25:23):
Right. And I will share with you, I have worked with clients who makes $2 million a year and they think like that. You can get to $2 million a year throwing spaghetti on the wall, but I will tell you can't get beyond that, and if you have thrown spaghetti on the wall to the point of $2 million, that's a lot of spaghetti to wade through to figure out what actually got you where you are. So, anyone who is starting, who is starting to learn how to analyze data from the beginning, you will be in a far better position to make decisions as you scale your business.

Diane Evans (00:26:09):
And this lady had a really successful business too, successful as far as... But I always thought, "But if you took the time to look at your numbers, it would be probably much more successful, and I think you'd waste less time."

Salome Schillack (00:26:23):
Yeah, absolutely.

Diane Evans (00:26:24):
Be more efficient.

Salome Schillack (00:26:25):
Yeah, and that's the whole point for me is we need to waste less time and waste less money.

Diane Evans (00:26:33):
Right.

Salome Schillack (00:26:33):
How much money do we waste in those early years?

Diane Evans (00:26:37):
I'm a total course addict, and I wanted the formula, and maybe that's the years in corporate because you usually have a formula and that's all you get to do.

Salome Schillack (00:26:48):
Well, you also have a formula in school, right, because you have a teacher who gives you a curriculum and tells you memorize this.

Diane Evans (00:27:04):
I was very good at school. Yes.

Salome Schillack (00:27:05):
And if you memorize it and you can regurgitate it on a test, then you succeed.

Diane Evans (00:27:05):
Yeah, and I was very good at school. I memorized. I took the test. I was a good tester. I got good grades. So, but in some ways I'll tell you, it really set me up for failure because I was considered, quote, smart, and that was really the only thing that I was, an attribute as a kid. That was really my only thing that I was complimented on growing up is you're smart, but I'll tell you what, then I get out, and I'm not successful. I can't keep a job. I didn't get fired, but I kept getting a new one. So, all a sudden, I'm smart. I go to college because that's what smart people do, but I'm not successful. I don't have a job that I've become a VP yet, or I've climbed a ladder, or I don't have any outward signs of success, and so it was very disappointing and kind of surprising. I thought if I was smart, that would translate into success, but it doesn't. Creativity, finding the right match for you maybe, I don't know, but that was always kind of my shame point.

Salome Schillack (00:28:15):
Hmm. I see that. I hear that. Yeah. I think there's this, I think your creativity and your smart is two circles, and they are moving closer and closer and closer to each other, and when they meet each other and they integrate with each other, I think you have no idea how successful you can be.

Diane Evans (00:28:44):
Well, I'd love to hear that.

Salome Schillack (00:28:45):
Well, the beauty of it is while you're on this journey that you're on now, the day you get to the point where you check the box for what you measure as success today, when you get there, it's not going to matter to you.

Diane Evans (00:29:02):
Mm-hmm.

Salome Schillack (00:29:03):
Yeah. You're going to be detached from it.

Diane Evans (00:29:08):
Yeah.

Salome Schillack (00:29:09):
So, you started a local photography business which turned into teaching women, women or anyone, how to take better photos.

Diane Evans (00:29:20):
Anyone but mostly women. When it comes to photography, we learn very differently, and most of the instructors are men and they almost all focus on the equipment, the gear.

Salome Schillack (00:29:34):
Sound like a dude.

Diane Evans (00:29:36):
They want to talk about lenses and equipment, and I've been to so many photography workshops and I just think, "Oh, why are we talking about lenses?" or they'll ask me which lens I use and I think, "Ugh." I say, "I don't know. I don't remember the numbers of all of that."

Salome Schillack (00:29:51):
It just works.

Diane Evans (00:29:52):
Yes, and they focus on the technology and the camera settings, and it didn't help me in my learning process. So, I have a very different approach in that we talk about mindset stuff and confidence and believing in yourself and not judging yourself based on other people's stuff, and we can do the technology. I'm going to hold your hand and we're going to walk through it together, and you're going to get to the other side, and it's going to make sense, and I'm not going to assume you know it up front, like a lot of them do.

Salome Schillack (00:30:23):
Yeah. Oh, I love that. That's beautiful. And your students, where do they travel because they're all taking travel photos, right?

Diane Evans (00:30:30):
Yeah. All over. All over. I mean, I did a webinar last week and someone was going to Antarctica and somebody Germany and somebody Maine in the United States. So, really all over the world, and I love that I have students who live all over the world. That makes it fun too.

Salome Schillack (00:30:52):
Yeah, I was going to say I can probably travel down my street and take some travel photos.

Diane Evans (00:30:58):
Yeah, absolutely. And you should before you go on your trips so that you're ready.

Salome Schillack (00:31:04):
So that I'm ready, yes, and so that you see how beautiful your own [inaudible 00:31:08] is.

Diane Evans (00:31:08):
Right.

Salome Schillack (00:31:09):
It's one of the gifts COVID gave me. We were blocked into our state into Queensland. We couldn't go out of Queensland for two years, and so the Schillacks love to travel, but we're always going overseas, and we had to travel inside our own state, and we have the Great Barrier Reef here.

Diane Evans (00:31:27):
I know, I know.

Salome Schillack (00:31:28):
We have the Daintree Rainforest here which is supposed to be the oldest rainforest in the world. It's beautiful. So, it's kind of like in your backyard. So, let's continue talking about your journey. So, two and a half years, and it's changed from a local business to an online course. What other big events were there in that two and a half years that some of the listeners will go, "Yes, that's where I'm at now."

Diane Evans (00:32:05):
Well, let me tell you one big event is I started my online business and rolled out my first online course in March of 2020.

Salome Schillack (00:32:16):
Oh I did too. I sold a course that opened on 20th of March 2020. It was not just you.

Diane Evans (00:32:25):
And in the travel industry of all places to be.

Salome Schillack (00:32:27):
And in the travel industry.

Diane Evans (00:32:30):
And so, my first launch, I thought, "Well, did it not do well because I did something wrong or because COVID hit and nobody's allowed to travel?" Who knows? Yeah.

Salome Schillack (00:32:40):
They're not even traveling to work, yeah.

Diane Evans (00:32:44):
I had this vision of doing onsite or in person workshops and retreats with PhotoFluent, but I thought, "I want people to have the skills before they get there." So I thought the perfect combination is to have online courses and in person retreats. So, when COVID hit, I thought, "Okay, great. I will start with the online portion." So, that's what I did is start with the online component and found out I really loved doing online courses. It's fun. I enjoy doing it, but again, it's so complicated, and there's so much to implement and put together and to find your right audience and your right offer.

Diane Evans (00:33:30):
So, I've really grown through that, and I'll tell you what, Salome, I think one of my biggest growth factors right now is not just learning the you call it profitable customer journey, and that has been huge for me to figure out where do my people come from and how do they move through my ecosystem, but to go from this emotional roller coaster of entrepreneurism, whatever word we're going to call that, business ownership, to having a steadier belief in myself and in my business, even without the proof, and people kept saying, "You have to believe it without the proof," and I thought that doesn't even make logical sense.

Diane Evans (00:34:25):
But one of the quotes I keep close by is that successful people hang on when everyone else has let go, and I read it every day, and I know that it will happen, and I've done enough meditations and visualizations and mantras to know in my heart that it will.

Salome Schillack (00:34:45):
Absolutely.

Diane Evans (00:34:46):
And the proof will come, soon, I hope.

Salome Schillack (00:34:53):
I know. I love that. I felt like I quit three years into it when I went back to my job, and I remember feeling the shame, feeling the failure. Literally, whenever I thought about it, my cheeks would flush, my stomach would turn. I felt like I had to justify my choice for going back to work to any stranger who asked me how the business is going. It was such an emotionally negative experience, and I felt like such a failure, and in hindsight, looking back at it, it was the best gift I could have given myself because going back to my job meant I could pay off the $40,000 debt I'd accrued. It meant my husband was not under as much financial stress because he was going gray really fast because of my business, and he's very supportive and we are going to talk about supportive husbands because I know you and I have very similar husbands who are supportive and they want to see the money, but that feeling. So, let's talk about successful people... Say your quote. What's your quote? Say that again?

Diane Evans (00:36:14):
Successful people hang on when everyone else has let go.

Salome Schillack (00:36:18):
Yeah. So, what does hanging on mean for you?

Diane Evans (00:36:23):
Well, I think when you said you felt shame, you were embarrassed because you went back to work, I've certainly considered getting some regular paid work, and I also am embarrassed. There's a lot of shame around I feel like I'm failing, when I'm not making money. So, sometimes I feel like I'm hanging on and it's just idiotic. Who hangs on when they don't make any money? Who just keeps going and doing this same thing over and over? But then I think, "You're not doing the same thing over and over." You shift, you try something new, you shift again, you try something different, but-

Salome Schillack (00:36:57):
I'm a idiot.

Diane Evans (00:36:58):
Yeah. Well, I am too. I mean, I know that-

Salome Schillack (00:37:01):
Yeah, you can sign me up all day for idiot.

Diane Evans (00:37:03):
... there would be a whole lot of people that would look at my business over the last few years and think, "Why the heck are you still doing this?" including sometimes my husband. We've had that conversation quite a few times where he is supportive, he wants it for me, but he sees how hard I work. He's never seen me work this hard because I never have, and yet...

Salome Schillack (00:37:24):
You've never been happy, yeah.

Diane Evans (00:37:26):
So, I think he gets frustrated with the fact there isn't money coming in, but also he gets frustrated with how hard I work and how little I get back from it right now. I believe it's going to come. All of this is going to pay off, but he doesn't have that mindset. He believes what he can see right in front of him, and so I feel like I constantly have to justify in my own head and with him that I'm hanging on and it's going to be worth it.

Salome Schillack (00:37:56):
Yeah, it's hard. It's hard when you have to justify it and you're almost hanging on believing it yourself.

Diane Evans (00:38:09):
Yes. Yes, it is.

Salome Schillack (00:38:13):
You're a hundred percent in on the fact that this is going to happen and I'm committed to this, and you have moments of doubt and then you have an external voice who also says, "Really? Really? Really?" And my husband's very much the same. He's very supportive, and I remember wanting to throw him out of a window every time he said to me, "Just show me the money. I believe you're going to get there, show me the money." I wanted to punch him.

Diane Evans (00:38:48):
Yes.

Salome Schillack (00:38:49):
And even now, I've shown him money. I've shown him money, and even now I talk about my next big dreams, my next big goals, and he goes, "Yeah, show me the money." And I go, "You just buckle in, dude."

Diane Evans (00:39:02):
Right. Oh, I will.

Salome Schillack (00:39:04):
Yeah, challenge accepted. You know?

Diane Evans (00:39:08):
Yeah, and I think that's the shift that's happened for me lately over the last couple months is that I didn't quite believe it either. I wanted to, I did the mantras, the visualizations, all the mindset stuff, and I told myself, "I believe it." I journaled I believed it. But every time he would say it out loud, I think, "Oh, he's right." And now I think, "Buddy, you better get yourself ready because we're going to move to France." Once my business is successful, we're moving to France, and he says it like, "Oh, okay, sure. We're moving to France." And I think, "Oh we are, we are. You better start learning your language, buddy, because we are moving to France."

Diane Evans (00:39:51):
And now, I can kind of deflect his sarcasm and his disbelief because I've built a shield of belief around me.

Salome Schillack (00:40:00):
Oh I love that. I love that, and you know that letting go and finding a job is not the same thing.

Diane Evans (00:40:10):
Yes, I do, and you've helped me realize that too because I love to hear people's stories and their journeys, and so when I hear over and over people's success stories, it just makes me feel bad about myself. So, I want to hear. I'm sorry that you went through that, but I love to hear that you were in it three years and then went back to work, and I think, "Okay, so she's still here doing it," and you're successful, and so if I have to go supplement with some income somewhere, that's okay, and maybe it'll even take the pressure off.

Salome Schillack (00:40:42):
You're right.

Diane Evans (00:40:42):
PhotoFluent's not going anywhere. I love it too much. It's too much a part of my soul, and he doesn't believe this or know this, but I think he feels like, at a certain point if I fail, I'll go get a job, and we will say, "Oh, well, we tried."

Salome Schillack (00:40:56):
Nah. That's just doubled down.

Diane Evans (00:40:57):
No, it's not going away.

Salome Schillack (00:40:59):
That's doubled down. I started working from 8:00 to midnight every night, 8:00 to midnight. After I put the kids to bed, I just worked on it. I want you to know that letting go, letting go and finding a job is not the same thing. Letting go and taking a break is not the same thing. Letting go and shifting gears is not the same thing. Yeah, we just have to persist. The person who let go is the one who stops trying. The one who completely gives up, that's the person who lets go, and I think there's also, there's letting go also in trying one business, then trying a whole nother business, then trying a whole nother business, then trying a whole nother business, I would say that's also letting go because you got to try one thing until it works, and particularly in the photography space, there's enough evidence that there is a market for teaching women how to take good travel photos. So, it's not like you're trying to invent, I don't know, underwear for dogs.

Diane Evans (00:42:20):
We had that.

Salome Schillack (00:42:20):
It sells? Really? Damn, I'm in the wrong business. You know what I'm saying?

Diane Evans (00:42:34):
Yeah, I do.

Salome Schillack (00:42:38):
I think maybe there's a space to sit and explore, well, what does letting go mean.

Diane Evans (00:42:43):
Yeah, because not everybody has the luxury to sit there for three years and lose money.

Salome Schillack (00:42:47):
And it is a beautiful luxury that we have.

Diane Evans (00:42:50):
It is. I'm incredibly grateful, very grateful for that. It hasn't been easy because it's not... He's not over there just saying, "Honey, you lose as much money as you possibly can."

Salome Schillack (00:43:02):
Go ahead and take my vacation money and spend it on more Facebook ads.

Diane Evans (00:43:08):
And then there's the whole shame around that. I've supported myself my whole life, and now, suddenly, I'm dependent on another human being financially, and it does not feel good. The amount of pressure I put on myself to be successful right now is another thing I have to really work through and release and meditate through. He's not putting as much pressure on me as I'm putting on myself.

Salome Schillack (00:43:39):
I can see in the year that we've worked together how you've let that pressure go. I can see how that has... In a year ago, it was like, "I must get this right now."

Diane Evans (00:43:56):
And I was holding on so tight I was strangling it.

Salome Schillack (00:44:00):
Yeah, and I think you're going to see the more you let it go, the easier it becomes.

Diane Evans (00:44:06):
And that sounds good in theory, but when people tell you that you have to let go, you think, "Let go? I have to try harder." It's such a balance though.

Salome Schillack (00:44:19):
It is, and it's a bit like an onion. I feel like I have peeled that onion over and over again because it's a life lesson. You're learning it in a very acute way right now, but three years from now, when you're rolling in dough, you're going to be learning it again because your business is going to shift into a new phase and you're going to be like, "Oh damn, I'm needing to let go again."

Diane Evans (00:44:44):
Right, because then I'll have a team, and I'll be trying a whole new ventures, yeah.

Salome Schillack (00:44:48):
And I'll tell you, the resilience you're learning now, everything you're learning now is tenfold bigger when you have a team, and the other day, I said to someone, who did I say it to? Oh, it's this spiritual coach that I'm working with, my woo-woo coach. I said to her, "I feel anxiety because I am responsible for 10 people's mortgages," and she goes, "Hold up, are you responsible for their mortgages? That's a mountain that you put on your shoulders for no reason." I went, "Okay, yeah. Yeah, they are responsible for their mortgages. I am responsible for running a profitable, well-managed business that pays them a salary." But in my head it's like what if they can't pay their mortgage, take on their whole lives. But it's not that, that makes it hard, and it makes it troublesome, and it makes it survival, whereas if it's joyful and fun and light and we get to pay them a delicious salary, so much different.

Salome Schillack (00:46:11):
So, your online course you're launching right now.

Diane Evans (00:46:16):
Yes.

Salome Schillack (00:46:17):
Yes. How often are you going to launch this?

Diane Evans (00:46:20):
Well, I don't know, Salome. You tell me. Well, I launched it the end of last year, did not have a successful launch. So, I kind of I stepped back and I evaluated what went wrong. I really did some more research, heavy research into kind of parallel businesses, similar models, and so I repackaged, and I looked at my offer and my audience, and so this is kind of taking what I've done before and putting it out as basically a new offer. So, I take the results and then from there I decide what do I do next. I had it all mapped out for the year. First I'll launch in this day, and then I at launch at three month, and then, and then, and then you said, "Let's just look at one step at a time." That feels good. Maybe every month. There's so many different models of do I launch it every month, do I keep a live program going and everybody's on the same track. So, there's a lot of different things I'm evaluating. It just depends what next week brings.

Salome Schillack (00:47:35):
I love that, what next week brings. Every year I record a podcast why I don't do annual planning and it stinks.

Diane Evans (00:47:45):
I listened to that and I loved it, yes.

Salome Schillack (00:47:46):
Yeah, it's this, it's because when you're inventing things, how are you supposed to plan because you're still inventing, and for my business, for a long time, the agency side, I couldn't plan for that. It was just a machine that has to turn over the same thing over and over and over, and so for the content piece, it was like, sure, we can plan some things, but we're also going to need to not plan some things because it's all very flexible and very dependent on the program, and I feel like there's not enough people that say this, that there's a time in your business where you don't plan, you just execute. Okay, I hustle.

Diane Evans (00:48:30):
And I think Russel Brunson maybe is the one who does launch after launch after launch after launch, and you learn how to launch that way. You learn how to get good at webinars.

Salome Schillack (00:48:40):
You do.

Diane Evans (00:48:40):
And when you first said, "Maybe you'll launch again next month," I thought, "I don't know what that looks like," and I thought, "That's okay. Well, future Diane will figure that out." And my mantra right now is I am open to creative solutions, and so I feel like I'm not planning out too far in advance, and we'll see where each step takes me to the next place, I guess.

Salome Schillack (00:49:08):
I love that, and it is this action energy that's going to get you to results faster because the more action you can take with a clear goal in mind, I'm not saying just spaghetti on the wall action, clear goal in mind, data-driven decisions, but quick action, the quicker you'll get feedback, and the feedback, sometimes that feedback comes in the form of money. Sometimes it comes in the form of not money, but it's always a result, and it's always feedback, and you just got to take it on board and work with it and do it again as quick as possible.

Diane Evans (00:49:49):
Yeah, and next week I have a conference, an actual in person conference at women in the travel industry so I'm very interested in where that will take me because I know Amy Porterfield talks a lot about how that made such an impact on her business is meeting with people in person, and conferences, and getting referred to different things, and collaborating with people, and I have not had the opportunity to do that since my business started because of COVID. So, now, I'm trying to get out there and talk to more people, and that I think will also break open some new opportunities.

Salome Schillack (00:50:23):
Absolutely. I love that, and you can just sell your course to people who are ready to buy it from you. It was an in-person conference and it was Amy Porterfield's in-person conference that eventually helped me then quit my job and be able to work as a full-time ads manager.

Diane Evans (00:50:44):
Yeah, I remember now hearing that story too where you went to conferences really regularly and felt like that was a kind of a factor that pushed your business forward.

Salome Schillack (00:50:55):
Absolutely, absolutely. For me, so 2017 was the year I went back to my day job. So, I started the business in June, July. 1st of July 2014, I started it, and it had various iterations of a lot of different things. Some of it made a little bit of money. Some of it made not much money. It was a lot of work, just like you, trying to figure out. I feel like you have a lot more figured out than I did at that point. And then in 2017, I went back to my job, and I was back in that job from February 2017 until December. At the beginning of December, I got on an airplane from Perth where I lived then which is on the western side of Australia, so that means I have to get on like a six, seven-hour flight from Perth to either to Sydney or to Auckland, and then from Sydney or Auckland to LA, and then from LA to San Diego. So, 30 hours door to door. Yeah, 30 hours door to door.

Salome Schillack (00:52:04):
I remember my husband, the only way I could go to this conference is if I could convince my husband that the business can pay for it. So, I listened and I heard there was a US travel show on where they promote traveling to the US, obviously run by the US to Australians, and I went there, and I went to every ticket booth, every airline, and compare tickets, and I ended up getting a ticket for a thousand dollars which today, I'm looking at flights to New York right now, and they're two and a half thousand dollars. But so a thousand dollars, and I remember my hand literally shaking as I handed my credit card for the business over for that thousand dollars ticket, but as soon as I had it, I was like, "I'm going to America. I'm going to meet Amy Porterfield. I'm going to meet all of these other mentors I've had." Rick Mulready was there. David Duncan was there. Jasmine Star was there. Who's the podcasting guy? His name escapes me. They're all going to be there and I'm going to meet them, and I did, and I signed up four clients while I was there, and I came home and I quit my job, and I gave my boss finger, and a month later, I was self-employed and I was making like five grand a month.

Diane Evans (00:53:24):
Yeah. I feel like it could be a big shift for me as well because I'm going to have the opportunity to collaborate people for those in person workshops and those retreats, people that are already doing travel, and it's all women in travel. I mean, it's the perfect place for me. So, I feel like I have this great base now. COVID kind of helped me in that way because I probably would've been a little too scattered at first, but it really helped me. I had to sit at home like the rest of us, and I had to work on the online piece, but now I really understand that, and now I'm ready. I'm ready to spread my wings, fly.

Salome Schillack (00:54:02):
Ah, you're going to spread your wings and fly, all the way to Paris.

Diane Evans (00:54:05):
All the way to Paris.

Salome Schillack (00:54:06):
Oh, I can't wait to hear all about this live event that you're going to. I feel like that you're right, that is going to be... And all of the hard work you've done that you're not necessarily seeing the results of yet, when you meet those people in person and they see this asset that you've already built up, it gives you so much credibility, and it gives you instant connection with the right people, and they're going to be there, and they're going to be like, "Yes, Diane, I'm ready. Show me how to take photos."

Diane Evans (00:54:40):
And I know how to talk about it now. If I would've went two years ago when I signed up, I wouldn't have been able to have the same conversations.

Salome Schillack (00:54:48):
Yeah, now you know the copy inside out, you know exactly what their desires are, you know how to speak to their pain points, you know exactly how to sell this to them. So, that's very exciting. Is there anything else? What else would you say to anyone who is working on getting their business to a place where it is profitable and where they can tell all those external voices, "Look, it's working"? What would you say to them?

Diane Evans (00:55:15):
I think don't give up I feel is an obvious piece of advice and a luxury, but like you said, there's different ways of giving up. So, if you believe it in your heart, keep doing it on some level. And the other thing that I think has held me back my whole life is fear. And the other quote I have on my, I have to look at my board, everything you want is on the other side of fear, everything, and don't let fear of failure of whatever hold you back. If you dream it, if you want it, then you have to be uncomfortable every day, and do it anyway.

Salome Schillack (00:55:59):
Do it anyway, and do it anyway. Do it anyway, and pick up. I think, for me, the fear thing because that also doesn't go away, you know?

Diane Evans (00:56:09):
No.

Salome Schillack (00:56:10):
It's just onions. You just, you discover a new layer of fear. For me, it's been identifying when I'm procrastinating because I'm scared.

Diane Evans (00:56:23):
Yes, that's one of my tools of choice, or habits of choice.

Salome Schillack (00:56:30):
Yeah, I love [inaudible 00:56:30].

Diane Evans (00:56:30):
Yes, procrastination. I could clean out an inbox like nobody's business when I'm procrastinating.

Salome Schillack (00:56:36):
Oh yes. Oh yes. Oh yes. And it's funny how that has... When I started the business, I procrastinated by creating content for social media. Now, that's not an issue for me anymore. I don't create much content for social media anyway. I believe social media is just, it's a way to connect with people, but we don't need social media as much as a lot of people would have us believe, but now, it's other things. It's oh, the client still needs this thing, or I haven't analyzed that webinar, or I haven't... It's amazing the things your brain will present to you that it's like, "Oh, but the ducks aren't in a row yet. So, let me just put it off a little bit more."

Diane Evans (00:57:23):
And I love to create so I can work on my branding, my color scheme, how many color schemes I've picked because they're not just the right one, the graphic for that email. Picking gifts can take me long.

Salome Schillack (00:57:39):
Yes. That's a favorite one of mine too. Yeah.

Diane Evans (00:57:43):
Yeah.

Salome Schillack (00:57:44):
Yeah, yeah. I have heard someone talk about procrasti-branding.

Diane Evans (00:57:49):
Yes. Oh my gosh.

Salome Schillack (00:57:52):
Yeah, that's [inaudible 00:57:52].

Diane Evans (00:57:52):
Yeah. I really was thinking I need to revamp my whole website and finally I thought, "Let's do that next year. It's fine for now."

Salome Schillack (00:58:01):
It's fine for until you make a million dollars.

Diane Evans (00:58:05):
Yeah, I say next year, but kind of like when you say, "I don't want to go to the gym. Okay, I'll just go for 15 minutes," but then you always stay for half an hour or an hour. I say that, "Maybe we'll work on that next year," it might be 10 years before I redo my website.

Salome Schillack (00:58:18):
It might be. And you know what? It'll be fine.

Diane Evans (00:58:20):
Yeah.

Salome Schillack (00:58:20):
It'll be fine. It'll be fine. Yeah, fear. What are your best tips for overcoming fear?

Diane Evans (00:58:30):
You know, for me, a lifesaver has been meditation, and I suffered from depression when I was younger, and I don't think that's something that just goes away. I've just, I've really learned how to deal with it, live with it, and meditation is one thing that throughout my life that has really saved me from... I've had kind of anxiety-driven depression, and meditation is the thing that keeps me grounded and keeps me stable and keeps me... Because it's not just the 10 minutes or the 20 minutes that you sit on the cushion, it has so much that carries over into your life, and it just helps you start to recognize the thoughts that creep in there. Meditation, you're kind of swatting them away. Go away. I'm meditating now.

Diane Evans (00:59:17):
But then you learn, they creep in there, and you are not your thoughts. They're not true. They're your mother's voice or your teacher's voice or wherever they came from, and that, that has really helped me, and to develop those mantras that are kind of the old standbys that help me. So, when I wake up in the middle of the night, that's the time when I get the most fearful and the most anxious and the most panicky, and so I have mantras that I can just soothe myself with, calm myself down, kind of let go of those fears.

Salome Schillack (00:59:54):
Love that. You're a master. That's fantastic. That's wonderful. I also feel like it's this snowball effect of the meditation is the fitness, it's that fitness of learning, like you said, I am not my thoughts. I am just the thinker of my thoughts, and I can allow a thought to come up and allow it to be there without believing it.

Diane Evans (01:00:23):
And we can live with discomfort. As humans and in our culture, in the United States, you're not supposed to be depressed or sad or anxious. So, you take medication to get rid of all of that, but it's actually okay to feel. I've read a lot of Buddhist teachings, and you kind of get in there sometimes and just give it a hug. You don't have to analyze the heck out of it. You don't have to be happy all the time. You don't want to be sad all the time obviously or anxious all the time, but sometimes I just let that butterfly rumbling in my gut that's not comfortable, I just let it be there, and I meditate, and I journal, I do all the healthy things I know to do, and then all of a sudden, I realized it's not there anymore.

Salome Schillack (01:01:07):
Let it be. Yeah, just let it be there without judging it, yeah.

Diane Evans (01:01:13):
Mm-hmm.

Salome Schillack (01:01:13):
Ah, so powerful. It's fantastic.

Diane Evans (01:01:17):
We've covered a lot of ground today.

Salome Schillack (01:01:22):
we have. I feel like I'm going to have to change the name of this episode, but I don't know, like a whole lot of everything with Diane, but I think that's the beauty of getting to know each other is we really can talk about this stuff because we live it. We live it, and it's important. It's not the step by step, paint by numbers to growing your email list.

Diane Evans (01:01:48):
No, I sure wanted that. I really wanted the formula, and then I wanted somebody to come in, look at my business and tell me, "This is what's not working, and once you fix that, it'll be successful." But that's not happening.

Salome Schillack (01:02:04):
And then the universe is like...

Diane Evans (01:02:07):
Right. Oh, you have a lot to learn.

Salome Schillack (01:02:09):
Yeah. No, it's not going to be like that. Diane, thank you so much for sharing all your wisdom and your journey and your ups and downs with us, and I am really honored to be on your journey and be part of your journey, and I can't wait for so many women photographers to have your course in their hands and for your name to be a big name in travel photography. It's happening. It's happening. It's happening. We're making it come true because you're doing everything right.

Diane Evans (01:02:49):
Well, I want to thank you for inviting me to be your guest, and I want to thank you for having the podcast and inspiring me and so many people because you really are that perfect marriage between analytical and woo-woo, and that's what we all need.

Salome Schillack (01:03:09):
I love it.

Diane Evans (01:03:10):
So, thank you.

Salome Schillack (01:03:11):
You're very welcome. Thank you so much.

Salome Schillack (01:03:14):
I hope that interview with Diane really inspired you, and if you love this episode and you're a committed online course launcher who wants to learn how to grow your profits in your next course launch and you want to know how to successfully scale your online courses business to seven figures and beyond, then I'd love to see you inside the Launch Lounge. The Launch Lounge is the only community online that is dedicated solely to helping you develop every aspect of your online courses business so that you can build your business to scale with no one-size-fits-all solutions, just the right education you need when you need it, coaching from our team of experts in different areas of launching and scaling and the best community on the internet. The Launch Lounge is your online course building home if you want profitable launches that scale your business to seven figures and beyond. Get on the wait list for our next enrollment season. Go to shineandsucceed.com/launch. That is shineandsucceed.com/launch.

Salome Schillack (01:04:31):
Thank you so much for listening. If you had fun, please come back next week, and remember to hit that subscribe button so you never miss a thing.

157. 3 Things Every Online Marketer Needs To Know To Successfully Scale Their Online Course Funnels

24 May 2022 | By Salome Schillack

listen now:

This week on The Shine Show, we’re tackling the number one mistake holding most online course creators back (and what to do if you’ve already made it)!

But first, we’re heading to my kitchen.

Recently I set out to bake a cake. I had all my ingredients lined up; my apron was on, the oven was ready, and the instructions were simple (no double tray situations - if you remember back from #quesadillagate).

What could possibly go wrong?

I diligently measured all the ingredients and mixed them nicely into a .....runny, disgusting tasting goop!

WHAT THE…..

My culinary expert and cooking extraordinaire husband Emil came home to the goopy mess and was determined to solve the case.

Flour, check.

Butter, check.

Eggs, check.

Half a cup of baking powder, check.

"Wait, wait, wait. Half a cup of baking powder?" He burst out laughing. It was on this day I learned a very important, soapy-tasting lesson on the difference between baking soda and baking powder.

In the wrong proportion, this one little ingredient caused my whole cake to be an unwanted, overlooked waste of effort.

But if I had simply tweaked that one ingredient, my cake would have been a huge success, and the whole family would have queued up, ready to savor a slice.

The same goes for an online course. You might have all the right ingredients, but if one thing is slightly out of proportion, your whole online course cake could turn into a giant, unwanted, cyber soap-tasting mess.

Here's the good news.

There's no need to abandon the kitchen and give up on your course creation dreams. By simply tweaking the ingredients and using the correct measurements, you could be back on track to serving delicious, warm, chocolate online course cake that your students will be raving about. This week on The Shine Show, I share the three things every online course creator MUST do to scale their course successfully, including the number one mistake most online course creators make (and how to avoid it).

Ready to learn the secrets behind launching profitably, scaling your business, and creating a ton of moolah?

XXX

Salome

P.S. The Launch Lounge is where it is all at if you are a serious course creator who is ready to learn how to find more of your ideal students online, launch more profitably and scale your online courses business to 6 and 7 figures without following someone else’s paint by numbers, one size fits all, fly by night strategy. If you are ready to get down and dirty with your funnels and get the feedback you need to implement changes that will help you scale, join us in The Launch Lounge today. Enrollment closes at the end of this week.

Subscribe and Review in iTunes Please!

When you subscribe and review the podcast not only does that give me the warm and fuzzies all over, it also helps other people to find the show.

When other people find the show they get to learn how to create more freedom in their lives from their online courses too!!

So do a good deed for all womenkind and subscribe and review this show and I will reward you with a shout out on the show!!

Join The Launch Lounge today!

Links I mentioned in this episode:

Scroll down for a full transcript of this episode

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174. Some Thoughts On Making Lots Of Money

173. 3 Reasons NOW Is The Best Time To Start A Digital Courses Business with Amy Porterfield

172. 25 Biggest Lessons In Online Marketing I Learned From Amy Porterfield

171. Social Media: One Thing That Makes All The Effort Worthwhile

170. How to Choose the Right Name for Your Online Course

169. Content Planning For Posts VS Content For Your Course And Launches

168. Managing Your Money As A Small Business Owner with Darcie Milfeld

167. 3 Lies You Were Told About Hiring An Ads Manager

166. How To Create Your Online Course Faster with Gina Onativia

165. The Only Way Low Dollar Offers Are Working Today

164. New Ad Targeting Options That Are Working Now

TRANSCRIPT

Hello, and welcome to The Shine Show. Today we're going to explore three things every online course marketer needs to know to successfully scale their online course funnels and I'm happy to announce that we have for the first time in over 6 months opened the doors to The Launch Lounge. The Launch Lounge is the only community you want to belong to if you are a serious online course creator and you want to scale your courses business to a million dollars. You can go to shineandsucceed.com/launch to learn more about The Launch Lounge

(00:52):

Hello, my friends. It is lovely for me to be here with you. I am recording this on a beautiful fall Friday afternoon. It is quiet in my house. My husband said he's going to go pick up Mila, my husband, Emil. He has gone to pick up Mila who is my oldest. She's 10 years old and Elle, my youngest, is going for a play date this afternoon. I have got that wonderful Friday afternoon quiet that allows me to sit down here and hang out with you and record podcast episodes for you.

(01:30):

Now, very often on a Friday afternoon Emil is not at home or if he's working from home, which he's doing less and less now because he's back in the office, I pick up the kids from school. And when I do, Mila has this sneaky but genius way of getting me to take her to The Bottom Shed, which is a deli, and like a green grocer slash deli slash coffee shop. That is between the school and our house. And The Bottom Shed makes amazing carrot cake and that kid loves their chocolate cake.

(02:25):

And so often on a Friday afternoon, she would get in the car and she would give me the puppy dog eyes and convince me to stop between school and home at The Bottom Shed and pick up cake. And I tell you, it does not take too much of her to get me on board with Friday afternoon cake. As a matter of fact, I actually quite love it not just because I still have that Friday afternoon, I'm going to treat myself sort of feeling that I guess starts when we have jobs where we kind of make it through the week and we reward ourselves with some kind of a treat. I suppose that's some cultural conditioning that I will hold onto, because I enjoy my Friday afternoon cake.

(03:21):

But that kid knows exactly which buttons to press to get me to go and buy cake from The Bottom Shed on a Friday. And she also knows that mom is not going to bake any cake. I tried baking a cake. You know if you've been a listener of the show for a while, you know I was going to call it a love, hate relationship with cooking, but it's probably more of a hate, hate relationship. Cooking hates me and I hate cooking and I'm working on it, but I'm not trying to work on it too much. I'm just cruising by loving the fact that Emil absolutely lives for cooking, which is our saving grace otherwise we would live on, well, I would say healthy salads I can pick up from the deli, but I'm sure there would also be a much larger Uber Eats bill.

(04:19):

The other day I tried baking a cake and got ... This is embarrassing admitting it. I got mixed up between the baking powder and the baking soda. Did you know baking powder and baking soda are two different things? Of course you did. It is two very, very different things. And it should have given me a clue that I'm on the wrong track when it said I need to add half a cup of baking soda. And I looked at the baking powder container and thought, geez, that's almost half of the container, that's a lot.

(05:12):

And so instead of using baking soda, I poured in half a cup of baking powder. And needless to say, the cake did not even make it into the oven because the butter was just really, really super weird. And when Emil arrived to question my choices that I had made when I was like, "What is going on with his butter?" He cracked up laughing as he does. He laughs with compassion. It always entertains me to see how much my absolute, I don't know, what would you call it? My inability to achieve anything in the kitchen provides him with endless entertainment. He thought it's really funny when he pointed out to me the recipe actually says baking soda, not baking powder. And that there is a giant difference. So lesson learned.

(06:09):

That's why Miller knows not to ask me to bake a cake. She knows to have me go to The Bottom Shed on a Friday afternoon. And I provide my husband with endless entertainment with my baking antics. I hope I'm entertaining you with my baking antics too. It makes for such good educational metaphors, all of my baking stuff ups, which leads me right into what I was going to teach you today, what we were going to talk about, what we're going to explore together. Today is a little bit more of a teaching podcast. I like to mix it up a little bit to give you some interviews with people just like you, just like me and just like the people we admire and aspire to be like, or to achieve things that they have achieved.

(07:03):

And I also try to add in some teaching where I can, because I feel like knowledge is power. And we meaning me and my team sit on so much knowledge because we have this front row seat to so many successful and not so successful online course launches being the people who run the ads for these online courses, having been those people for three years.

(07:34):

Today I want to teach you a little bit of a model that I discovered that I stumbled upon, that I created when I was super frustrated with seeing people use their hard earned money to run ads for their launches only to end up with nothing at the end. And I'm talking about experienced launchers who were able to build large organic followings. And by large I mean, maybe 30,000 or 100,000 people on Instagram or YouTube and make money from them by selling their courses and then hire us to run ads for them only for the ads board to fall completely flat, that's one example.

(08:32):

The other example is people who hire us or other ads managers straight out of the gate first time launching and spend a ridiculous amount of money on their launch, whether it be webinars or challenges or whatever it might be. And again, to get to the end of that launch and to not have made any money is devastating. It is so devastating for me that I have closed the doors in the agency. A while ago already I closed the doors in the agency to any new launchers.

(09:20):

We will not run ads for new launchers because what I have come to learn is that the surefire way of losing your money is to over spend on ads where your offers haven't yet been proven, or you're not sure you have the right launch mechanism. What do I mean by that? What I mean by that is there are three key levers or three key ... You know what the inside of a watch look like, the clock, where there's one circular, what do you call those things that move? And then it moves the other one levers or systems or pulleys, or I'm forgetting the right word. But you know what I mean? Those circular things that the one turns and then it turns the next one. And that one turns the next one. And that one turns the next one.

(10:32):

There are three key levers that needs to be pulled in order to make money. But not just in order to make money, in order to have a scalable business. When you are building online course businesses and these three things are this. You might want to write this down, or come back and write it down if you're driving or if you're on the treadmill. Those three things are number one, you need traffic, you need an audience, you need people. You already know this because you probably started your business on social media. You probably started your business grabbing your phone and starting to just speak into your phone, creating reels, creating a newsfeed, going live, posting videos on YouTube, starting a podcast. You already know you need traffic.

(11:38):

We're going to unpack traffic a little bit more. You already know this is the second lever, you need an offer. Not just any offer, you need a good offer. You need an offer that your ideal customer cannot resist. An offer is different from an online course. Selling an online course has more to do with your offer than it has with your actual course. So if you've been taught how to create an online course, but you haven't yet been taught how to create an offer, then that's the next thing to focus on. If you've been taught to create an audience or traffic, but you haven't yet been taught how to create offers, then that's what you need to focus on next.

(12:44):

Number one, you need traffic. Number two, you need offers. Number three, you need the right launch mechanism for the price point at which you're selling your course. I often tell the students in A-Lister that the secret formula to making money online is audience plus offer equals money. And in a very simple format, it really is just audience plus offer equals money. But there is this third element that comes in and that is your launch mechanism. And it has to do with how that traffic moves through your funnel from being a free, I have never heard of you relationship to becoming a paid student who loves you and cannot sing your praises enough and tells all their friends to come and buy your course too.

(13:59):

Now let's unpack all three of these things in a little bit more detail, traffic, offers and launch mechanisms so that you can understand how these three levers work together and how they have a relationship with each other and how you are not just pulling one of the three, but you've got to pull all three in the right relationship to each other if you want to build a profitable online course business, and if you want it to be scalable.

(14:32):

The first thing, let's talk about traffic. Over the Easter holidays, my family and I went to Melbourne. It was so nice to be able to get out of Queensland. Queensland is the state where we live and we have pretty much been locked in Queensland for two years. We've done a lot of vacationing in Queensland, which is beautiful, one of the most beautiful places on earth in my opinion, near the Great Barrier Reef and most beautiful beaches.

(15:04):

We're just so lucky to live in such a beautiful part of the world. But I have ants in my pants when it comes to traveling, so I need to explore new places. After two years of exploring my backyard, I was very happy that I get to get on a plane and fly somewhere domestic again. We're flying internationally soon too. We're going to Fiji in June, but it was just nice to be able to leave the state and go somewhere else.

(15:35):

We booked tickets to Melbourne. Melbourne is another city in Australia, for those of you who are not familiar. Melbourne is the cultural capital of Australia. Everything that is cool happens in Melbourne, the food for anybody who loves food, who loves wine, who loves beer, who loves chocolate and who can just walk around inner city looking at all the little lane ways and the beautiful wall art and the tiny little tucked away whiskey bars. It is just the coolest, coolest place. I love Melbourne.

(16:20):

We went there for a week and my husband, Emil, he got us tickets to the Formula One. Formula One is car racing, but it is car racing ... I mean, I know when I say car racing you think like hot cars, it's those funny looking cars with the giant wheels. Look up Formula One if you don't know what it is, because it's actually quite a fascinating sport. We went to the Formula One and poor Melbourne, I think Melbourne is recorded as being the most locked down city in the world during COVID. Because if I ask them how long were they locked down, most of them just go, "We don't even know." They're all in shock still. A lot of my team members live in Melbourne.

(17:07):

But I think it's something ridiculous like 500 days, more than 500 days. That is just under two years that the poor people of Melbourne have been completely locked down in their homes. Melbourne is on the loose now and we can go there and Melburnians can go out. They're all still a little bit gun-shy. But the Formula One, there were 400,000 people at the Formula One. 400,000 people were at the Formula One. That is a lot of traffic. Took us an hour in an Uber and we paid $150 for the Uber one day from the Formula One back to our hotel and it would've been a 15 minute walk.

(18:11):

We sat in an Uber and paid $150 for the Uber, which could have been a 15 minute walk. But at that point, our kids were ugly tired, so we made the sacrifice. I don't think my kids would have ... I think they would've reported me to childcare abuse, whoever, if I made them walk that 15 minutes. But I want you to imagine for a minute all of those traffic, all of the traffic from 400,000 people all coming in through one or two gates. And then imagine for a second that as those 400,000 people come in through the gate, that they are funneled out of the racing stadium, let's call it a stadium or the racing place. As they come in, they're funneled out again. As they come in, they just drop out again.

(19:21):

You might say there were 400,000 people who came to the Formula One, but if they all dropped out before they made it to the stands where they could sit and enjoy the race, that traffic would just be a giant exercise in moving people. Now, how does this relate to your funnel? Traffic is just traffic. Unless your traffic converts to sales. And for your traffic to convert to sales, you need offers that convert. Otherwise it is just a giant exercise in moving people around. That is the number one mistake I see new launchers make or I see people making who spend a ton of money on ads, on webinars, without testing their offers first.

(20:41):

Next time you think about spending a ton of money, sending people to your sales page or sending people to a webinar for an offer that you have not yet tested, hear my voice in your head, you are just moving people around. Let's look at a couple of different sources of traffic and how you can be moving people around. You can have organic traffic. Organic traffic comes from social media, or it comes from SEO or it comes from guest appearances on other people's shows or podcasts or events, live events. Organic traffic are all the things that require your energy. And when we start a business and we don't have a lot of money, we use our energy. Our energy is what goes into creating momentum.

(21:47):

We hustle, hustle is not a bad thing. Hustle is exactly what you need to do at the start. If you get stuck in hustle and you never get out of it, that's a bad thing, but that's where paid traffic comes in. As soon as you start building a bit of an audience and understanding what your audience wants from you, you can create some engagement ads. And now you're using engagement ads to build engagement on your social media, so you can cut back a little bit on posting as regularly.

(22:24):

But the whole point of all of this is really to get people onto your email list. You might hustle hard at the beginning to use social media to get people on your list. And then as you start making a little bit of money, you start replacing that energy that you are pouring into social media with your money. You start replacing your energy with your money by running list building ads.

(22:53):

Paid traffic includes all of your Facebook and Instagram ads. Maybe you're starting to run some ads on LinkedIn or Twitter or TikTok or somewhere else. And you could even be running some ads, search ads on YouTube or Google. YouTube and Google Ads or search ads. And they work a little bit differently than Facebook and Instagram. Facebook and Instagram ads are what we call interruption marketing because you're putting an ad in front of someone and you're interrupting them when they're scrolling through the newsfeed, which is why your ad needs to grab their attention.

(23:30):

When you think about traffic and you think about bringing your 400,000 people to the Formula One, I want you to remember that when you start out, you're going to use your energy. But as you get money, you're going to use your money to replace your energy. You spend only enough time on social media to direct them to either your large format content, which is your podcast or your blog or your video blog and to your email list. That's where you want to build relationship with your audience.

(24:06):

I am here right now hanging out with you building relationship. And the 40 minutes that I'm spending with you is worth a thousand Instagram posts, right? You can see that. Because you're listening to me and you can go, "I really like what she's saying." Or I don't really dig this chick, I'm going to go find someone else. And it's both as cool. At least now we know where we stand, right?

(24:36):

And I want to build relationship with my audience here on the podcast and in my email list, when I'm emailing them, when I'm emailing you, hopefully you're on my list. I'm going to pour my energy into that and I'm going to use my money to build my list. I'm going to use my money to get engagement. Traffic alone can never get you more money. Traffic is just traffic. Getting more people to your sales page is rarely the problem. So often I hear people say, "I just need more people." You don't need more people, you need a better offer. You already have people. They're just not saying yes to your offers. So let's talk about number two is offers.

(25:39):

So you know on a Friday afternoon when Miller says to me, "Hey mommy, you want to go get cake at The Bottom Shed?" Nine times out of 10, we stop at The Bottom Shed and we get cake. And the kid is genius because her timing is right. She knows my guard is down on a Friday afternoon. She also knows my sugar craving is up on a Friday afternoon. The pain point, she's got my pain point right, because she knows it's Friday afternoon, mommy's going to want to relax. Mommy's going to want to chill. Mommy's tired. Mommy feels like she deserves a treat after a long week. And she knows my desire, she knows. She only has to mention Bottom Shed carrot cake and my mouth starts drooling. She's making an offer at the right time. She understands my pain point and she understands my desire. Those three things make up a good offer.

(26:48):

And that's when she can look at me on a Friday and say, "Hey mommy, let's go get cake." And the answer is always, yes, let's go. When we start our online courses businesses and we start launching, we spend more time thinking about what we want to teach in our online courses than what our offer should be. And I want to propose that that's backward. I want to say, unless you're spending at least the same amount of time thinking about your offer and thinking about who your ideal customer is and what she really, really, really wants from you, not what you have, but what she wants. Then you should be spending the same amount of time thinking about your offer as you are about building your online course and what you're going to be putting in your online course.

(27:47):

A good offer is an offer that is made to the right person. And so if you've filled your email list with one segment of your audience, but you're working on an offer for a different segment, you need to be building your list with that different segment too. Because if it's all one kind of person, but you're working on a program for a different kind of person, you're not building your audience, you're not going to have enough traffic.

(28:19):

A good offer is an offer that understands the pain points it solves. And these pain points can be described in a very, very specific way. When you find yourself writing copy that involves words like feeling overwhelmed, feeling tired, feeling stressed. Those are very generic conditions that can almost be applied to anything. I want to challenge you to go one step further to uncover what it looks like for your ideal customer when she feels overwhelmed, because it might not be the same for all of us and it might not be a 50 year old man who has an overwhelmed problem, it probably manifests very differently for him than a 50 year old woman who is recently divorced and is also trying to lose the weight that she gained from the stress of her divorce.

(29:32):

What does that overwhelm mean to them? So understand the pain points in detail. A good offer is an offer that understands the deepest desires of their ideal customer. I always love to use the example of weight loss because this is such an easy one. Well, you can have so many different health coaches or personal trainers and each of them can describe the deepest desire of their ideal customer very differently. I had a student in A-Lister who was a personal trainer and she specialized in giving brides beautiful arms, wedding dress ready arms. That gives me goosebumps because that is such a good offer. That is such a good desire to understand. But that's very different from the new mom who wants to lose the baby fat or the dude who wants rock hard abs or the other dude who wants to bench however much weight.

(30:44):

My husband always comes home from the gym and tells me how much he benched and I'm like, "Yeah, that means nothing to me." Good, great, awesome. You're very strong. I don't know what you mean. A good offer overcomes their internal and external objections. By that we mean their external objections or the things that's physically stopping them from buying. Like how long do I have access to this thing? Do I need to start straight away? Will this give me the result I want? Often an external objection is money, but I completely ignore that because if you charge a dollar for your program, money's going to be an objection.

(31:28):

But it also should overcome their internal objections and their internal objections is that tiny little voice that says, "Can I make this work?" Sure it works for you, but you have X, Y, Z that I don't have, can this work for me? That's where testimonials are so effective because when we share testimonials, people put themselves in the shoes of those people whose testimonial they're reading and then they go, "Ah, if she can do it, I can do it too." A good offer overcomes their internal and external objections. A good offer gives them a good reason to make a decision now.

(32:12):

If Miller says to me, "Mommy, let's go get carrot cake." And I say, "No, let's do it later. Let's put it off." She'll say, "Mommy, you know we're not going to have time on the weekend and we're going to forget and we're going to be rushing around. And then they might not have fresh carrot cake anymore. Because you know it comes in on a Friday and you know by 5:00 this afternoon it's all going to be sold out and there might not be tomorrow."

(32:40):

If she says that to me, I'm like, "Right, let's get in the car. Let's go now. Carrot cake now, let's do it." She knows how to give me a good reason to make a decision now. You make use of bonuses to create scarcity and urgency, to get the fence sitters, which it is just normal human nature to sit on the fence and to not make a decision. It's easier to not make a decision than to make a decision. So give people an incentive to make a decision now. Those are your elements of a good offer.

(33:18):

A good offer has nothing to do with your price. A good offer is something that is a no brainer that anyone will say yes to. If you don't have a good offer, discounting your offer is not going to make it better. People will not buy more because it's cheaper. If your offer sucks, your offer sucks. And if it sucks at a low price, you're still going to be selling nothing. Make an offer that they cannot refuse.

(33:51):

Now, let's explore for a second, what is the relationship between traffic, which we talked about first and offers. You need traffic in order to build an audience. Remember audience plus offer equals money. You need traffic to build an audience. You need an offer that your audience wants, that the audience then you've built wants. If you don't have enough traffic, you don't have an audience. If you have an offer that your audience doesn't want, you have no money.

(34:37):

I'm going to say that again. If you don't have enough traffic, you have no audience. If you have an offer that they don't want, you have no money. Practice making offers to your email list, build your traffic, build your audience on email, build your email list and make your offers to your email list, before spending any money on webinars and big launches or sending paid traffic to your sales page.

(35:17):

I can see in student's eyes when they've been struggling for a while to figure out how to sell their course or how to make money online. And they're at a point where they just go, "Maybe if I just put ads to my sales page it'll work." Does not work. Do not fall for that temptation. The only thing you're going to do is make Zuckerberg richer. If your email list is not saying yes to your offer, the solution is not to just pay for more cold traffic to your sales page. If you launched and you didn't make money, it's not because your ads didn't reach the right people. It might be because you didn't spend enough time making offers to your warm audience in order to know what converts and what doesn't.

(36:19):

And then that brings me to the third lever that plays a big part in the success of your online course business. And that is your launch mechanism. Traffic needs offers. And the thing that ties traffic and offers together are launch mechanisms. By launch mechanism I mean a webinar, a video series, a challenge, a workshop, an email sequence. Often these are referred to as funnels. But I feel like the launch mechanism is part of a funnel. The traffic moves through a funnel from the top through the launch mechanism to the bottom where they make a sale.

(37:15):

Like the cake that I baked, where I messed up the baking soda and the baking powder, you need the right ingredients in the right proportions. Half a cup of baking powder is not going to get me a cake. Half a cup of baking soda will get me a cake, but half a cup of baking powder will not. I had not just the wrong ingredient, but I also had the wrong proportions of the wrong ingredient. If I had the right ingredient and the right proportions, I would've had a cake.

(37:52):

Let me explain this to you in some simple numbers. Let's say it costs you $10 to get one person to register for your webinar. So your traffic comes from an ad and you've paid for that person, and it cost you $10 per one person to register. Now let's say your offer converts really well, but your price point is $97 and you only had 25% of those people who registered for your webinar actually showed up for it. And then when 25% of them showed up, 10% bought.

(38:45):

Now, if you do the math on that, you will not be making money on a $97 offer. Because it's costing too much to get traffic into a launch mechanism where the money that goes out on the front end is not bringing in enough money on the back end when the traffic flows through this funnel. Now let's say instead of using a webinar, which is expensive and costs $10 per one person to come in, let's say you used a list building ad and it costs you $2 to get one person onto your list.

(39:35):

And 10% of people once they're on your list buys from you and your price is still $97. If the cost on the front end is $2 and the money out on the back end is $97. And you have a smaller funnel, like an email sequence. You could be making money for days, days, and days. So the principle here is that the higher the price point is, the bigger the mechanism is that you need, because the higher the price point is the more trust people will require of us. So if I'm going to be running cold traffic to a $20,000 coaching program, nobody's going to sign up without actually knowing something about me and about the results I can get.

(40:42):

Let's say if my budget was a thousand dollars and I ran that to my $20,000 coaching program, I wouldn't get very far. I need to figure out at which price point do I need what mechanism in order to have enough traffic that they see my offer and my offer converts. And the rule of thumb is this, if your offer is lower than $250, use an email sequence. If your offer is lower than $500, use a challenge or a workshop. If your offer is over a thousand dollars, use a webinar or a video series. And if your offer is over $3,000, use a webinar, a video series or a long form sales page that goes to booking a call kind of situation, goes through a book a call funnel is what we call it. The higher the ticket you sell, the warmer your people need to be.

(41:53):

The way you warm people up is by spending time with them. Someone who's going to buy a $97 course does not need more from you than an automated email sequence. Someone who's going to spend $20,000 needs to at least have spoken to you or someone on your team to make sure it's a good fit. Traffic, offers and launch mechanisms, those three things need to work together in a beautiful way to get you to a profitable online course launch and a scalable online business.

(42:33):

Now I'm wondering what kind of baker are you? Are you like me? You're making the weirdest cake by using bicarb instead of baking soda, or are you the kind of baker like Miller, who knows exactly how to traffic her mother to the cake shop on a Friday afternoon, offer me delicious carrot cake and then convert me to enjoy my cake every Friday afternoon.

(43:01):

I would love to hear from you. Come find me on Instagram and DM me, which one of the three, traffic, conversion or launch mechanism are you going to fix next so that you can get to launch your course profitably and scale your business and create a ton of money for you to live your life your way. Come and tell me on Instagram, I'll see you next week. Bye.

(43:27):

Thank you so much for listening, and if you want to learn even more marketing secrets, Facebook ad secrets, funnels and conversion secrets and you want to learn it inside the coolest community on the internet then I want to invite it to join us inside The Launch Lounge. The Launch Lounge is a monthly membership that is created for serious online course creators who are committed and ready to launch their courses with higher profits and scale their businesses to a million dollars. I want to invite you to go to shineandsucceed.com/launch to learn more about The Launch Lounge. I hope I see you inside The Launch Lounge

156. Three Design Trends The Algorithm Loves with Jacqui Naunton

17 May 2022 | By Salome Schillack

listen now:

Listen up, DIY designers! If your design strategy has so far been, "go for the pretty things,"....

Then LOG OUT OF CANVA because we need to chat!

As the old saying goes, a picture speaks a thousand words, so what exactly are you saying when it comes to your branding?

The cold hard truth is branding has the power to make or break your business.

In this episode of The Shine Show, we have the design genius and creative trendsetter Jacqui Naunton from White Deer.

But first, let's talk about the elephant in the room. Having a designer is ex-pen-sive! When first getting your online course ducks in a row, splashing out for a designer is the last thing you want to do.

Especially when design tools (hello #canva) are so accessible these days.

But just having a Canva account doesn't magically give you design principles. And these can be the difference between attracting or repelling your dream students.

Being the clever creative cookie she is, Jacqui found a way to share her design skills and teach entrepreneurs how to create their own scroll-stopping, jaw-dropping, memory sticking visual assets!

This week Jacqui joins me on the show and very generously shares all the insider design tips and tricks that will take your brand from flop to FAB!

This is one episode you cannot afford to miss, especially if you're a DIY designer.

XXX

Salome

P.S. Did this week's episode inspire you to get your creative ducks in a row? If you love what Jacqui says, you'll LOVE The Launch Lounge. It's where all the successful online course creators are hanging out to learn with & from each other. If you're ready to get serious about making moolah online, The Launch Lounge will get you there fast! Doors are opening with limited spots available. Join the waitlist, and all will be revealed soon! Secure your place here.

Subscribe and Review in iTunes Please!

When you subscribe and review the podcast not only does that give me the warm and fuzzies all over, it also helps other people to find the show.

When other people find the show they get to learn how to create more freedom in their lives from their online courses too!!

So do a good deed for all womenkind and subscribe and review this show and I will reward you with a shout out on the show!!

Put your name on The Launch Lounge waitlist

Links I mentioned in this episode:

Learn more about Jacqui Naunton here!